Scent bird for launcher work

[mtlhdr]

I think you're on the right track with the launcher idea. Just be sure to use a scent bird seperate from the launcher. Plant your scent bird (lock wing pigeon) at least 10 yards from the launcher (loaded with a flyer), and bring your dog perpendicular to the scent bird. Don't let her smell the bird in the launcher. When she points the scent bird, immediately trigger the launcher.

I read this quote in the "correcting hunting seasons problems" thread. I truncated it, I hope I didn't lose any context. It's not clear but I assume the scent bird is placed downwind of the launcher and this is the bird that the dog points. Is the scent bird specific for working on creeping, general steadiness work, etc? What are the benefits and potential drawbacks compared to using just a bird in the launcher? Help me understand a little more about the concept behind the scent bird. Thanks.

~Ben

[DonF]

Planting an extra bird or two is a good idea but, if your dog still needs the launcher, don't do it. The extra birds get flushed after the bird the dog pointed, Let's the dog know there could be one than one bird. If you plant a separate pigeon with the trap and you actually need the trap, you risk having your dog break and taking out the extra bird. Never lock the wings on a bird that is not rock solid. You have no control of the bird and even the bird itself can't help itself. Don't risk teaching your dog it's possible to catch birds on the ground.

[RoostersMom]

My older pointer never would point a bird in the launcher. She is the only dog I've seen that has this issue. A scent bird would have been a good idea during her training, but I didn't know any better then (she's 13 now). Every other dog I've worked has had no problems with birds in launchers alone.

[DonF]

I might say one thing about dog's that don't point birds in a launcher. The secret is to try and keep the dog from pointing it in the first place, pop the bird the moment the bird hits scent, try to keep it from pointing. Before you know it the dog will point before you can pop the bird. When that happen's, the dog win's. Then don't pop the bird unless the dog move's anything at all.

I think one of the bad things about the launcher is that if your trying to train with it and working a dog in on a check cord and stopping it when you see it hit scent, your working on teaching the dog that the bird in the launcher is a training bird. It will never hunt and point a pigeon on the ground and so it does become a training bird and the dog start's to loose interest. It'll be loose on point or bust blink the bird altogether. The easiest way to avoid that is to make what ever bird you use act like a wild bird. Dogs don't loose interest in wild birds.

Keep in mind also while your doing this launcher work, if the dog get's to close to the launcher but way out of the scent cone, pop the bird. You act like a wild bird!!

[DoubleBarrel GunDogs]

I think you're on the right track with the launcher idea. Just be sure to use a scent bird seperate from the launcher. Plant your scent bird (lock wing pigeon) at least 10 yards from the launcher (loaded with a flyer), and bring your dog perpendicular to the scent bird. Don't let her smell the bird in the launcher. When she points the scent bird, immediately trigger the launcher.

I read this quote in the "correcting hunting seasons problems" thread. I truncated it, I hope I didn't lose any context. It's not clear but I assume the scent bird is placed downwind of the launcher and this is the bird that the dog points. Is the scent bird specific for working on creeping, general steadiness work, etc? What are the benefits and potential drawbacks compared to using just a bird in the launcher? Help me understand a little more about the concept behind the scent bird. Thanks.

~Ben

Sorry I didn't articulate this very well the first time around.

1. Place a lock wing pigeon in a strip of cover that runs North and South if the wind is blowing from the West. (Mark the location with a piece of orange ribbon.)
2. Place the launcher(s) loaded with flyer(s) 10 yards further North.
3. Bring the dog in with a checkcord and a half hitch around his flank. Approach the scent bird (with the dog in front) from the South end of the field, and to the East of the planted bird. That way he'll enter the scent cone of the lock wing bird.
4. When he stops, launch a bird.
5. Don't allow him the opportunity to root out the planted bird. Which normally is not a problem, because he'll be focused on the fly away.
6. Bring him back to start, and repeat the drill.
7. Change locations in the field before repeating the drill to begin to generalize locations, and to keep him from memorizing the location of the scent bird.

The reason you don't want the scent bird in a launcher is two-fold:
1. You don't want the dog to be either injured by or startled by the launcher.
2. You don't want the scent of the bird camoflaged or contaminated by the launcher. This will often result in the dog needing or wanting to get closer to the bird than it should. Also, other scent (that should not be bird related) can be associated with the bird or take away from the natural scent.

I also use launchers in a drill to help steady flushing dogs, and as a maintenance drill. Always bring the dog upwind of the launcher in this instance. For many of the same reasons as above, you don't want the dog to smell the bird in the launcher. This is also done so the dog does not begin to anticipate the flush, which can cause them to pause or become sticky when they approach the launcher.

Nate

[cstokes/southeast,ks]

I think you're on the right track with the launcher idea. Just be sure to use a scent bird seperate from the launcher. Plant your scent bird (lock wing pigeon) at least 10 yards from the launcher (loaded with a flyer), and bring your dog perpendicular to the scent bird. Don't let her smell the bird in the launcher. When she points the scent bird, immediately trigger the launcher.

I read this quote in the "correcting hunting seasons problems" thread. I truncated it, I hope I didn't lose any context. It's not clear but I assume the scent bird is placed downwind of the launcher and this is the bird that the dog points. Is the scent bird specific for working on creeping, general steadiness work, etc? What are the benefits and potential drawbacks compared to using just a bird in the launcher? Help me understand a little more about the concept behind the scent bird. Thanks.

~Ben

Sorry I didn't articulate this very well the first time around.

1. Place a lock wing pigeon in a strip of cover that runs North and South if the wind is blowing from the West. (Mark the location with a piece of orange ribbon.)
2. Place the launcher(s) loaded with flyer(s) 10 yards further North.
3. Bring the dog in with a checkcord and a half hitch around his flank. Approach the scent bird (with the dog in front) from the South end of the field, and to the East of the planted bird. That way he'll enter the scent cone of the lock wing bird.
4. When he stops, launch a bird.
5. Don't allow him the opportunity to root out the planted bird. Which normally is not a problem, because he'll be focused on the fly away.
6. Bring him back to start, and repeat the drill.
7. Change locations in the field before repeating the drill to begin to generalize locations, and to keep him from memorizing the location of the scent bird.

The reason you don't want the scent bird in a launcher is two-fold:
1. You don't want the dog to be either injured by or startled by the launcher.
2. You don't want the scent of the bird camoflaged or contaminated by the launcher. This will often result in the dog needing or wanting to get closer to the bird than it should. Also, other scent (that should not be bird related) can be associated with the bird or take away from the natural scent.

I also use launchers in a drill to help steady flushing dogs, and as a maintenance drill. Always bring the dog upwind of the launcher in this instance. For many of the same reasons as above, you don't want the dog to smell the bird in the launcher. This is also done so the dog does not begin to anticipate the flush, which can cause them to pause or become sticky when they approach the launcher.

Nate

I plant birds in the launcher=Dogs point birds in the launcher. I never let the dog get close enough to a launcher for it to startle him/her. As far as a dog wanting to creep in and keep wanting to get closer...that should never be a problem, just press the button before this becomes a issue. I like to carry a bird bag with me. If the dog holds point I work up to the front and as soon as the dog even thinks about breaking I throw a bird from the bag and we move on to the next planted bird. Thus prevents a breaking dog from ever getting his mouth on a wing locked "scent bird", I just assume to totally eliminate that possibility. I think all of the above problems with launchers can be avoided by having good timing and a well planned strategy before entering the session. This is just my opinion, not saying its right for everyone.

[DonF]

My pup's all experience the launcher long before I ever let them try to get a point. I happy time them around on the cc and when I'n 10-15 yds from the launcher, I launch it with a bird in it. I stay up wind of it, don't wan't a little nose to get a snoot full, just want it to hear the thing and see a bird in the air. I guess there's a lot of ways of using the launcher but I believe that the best way is to make it work like a wild bird and flush accordingly. Anything else is a drill for the dog and it will likely grow tired of it. Then you have a dog you think won't point a pigeon. It's not that it won't point a pigeon, it's that it is tired of the drill!

[jczv]

I plant birds in the launcher=Dogs point birds in the launcher. I never let the dog get close enough to a launcher for it to startle him/her. As far as a dog wanting to creep in and keep wanting to get closer...that should never be a problem, just press the button before this becomes a issue. I like to carry a bird bag with me. If the dog holds point I work up to the front and as soon as the dog even thinks about breaking I throw a bird from the bag and we move on to the next planted bird. Thus prevents a breaking dog from ever getting his mouth on a wing locked "scent bird", I just assume to totally eliminate that possibility. I think all of the above problems with launchers can be avoided by having good timing and a well planned strategy before entering the session. This is just my opinion, not saying its right for everyone.

+1 on what cstokes said

I do use multiple launcher setups (especially for steadiness after the shot and fall) and occasionally when transitioning types of bird like pigeon to quail or chukar. Occasionally I've also used secondary birds out of the launcher, although that's generally once the dog is already completely dependable holding point.

As far as acclimating the dog to the launcher I've always both made sure the dog was bird crazy before before starting launcher work and either did stop to flush drills with the dog at a distance from the launcher or just 'parking lot drills' with either homers or just a toy or bumper so the dog knows launchers are fun and exciting.

But as said previously there's 50 ways to skin a cat

[DonF]

There's probably 51 ways. I do about the same with the launcher's. But once the dog is steady, I remove the launcher's and go to foot traps. Take away one launcher at a time and replace with foot traps. That way if the dog mess's up, pop the first bird. At this point that should stop the dog and there's still another bird out there, maybe two!

[mtlhdr]

Thanks everyone, this is helpful. I just bought my first launcher. I've done a little launcher work with the pup under the direct supervision of someone with a lot more experience, but I won't always have that resource with me in the training field. The "how" of things is always interesting, but the "why" is as important, if not more.

[cstokes/southeast,ks]

Thanks everyone, this is helpful. I just bought my first launcher. I've done a little launcher work with the pup under the direct supervision of someone with a lot more experience, but I won't always have that resource with me in the training field. The "how" of things is always interesting, but the "why" is as important, if not more.

None of the replies that you got are wrong. There is a ton of training information on here. You just have to pick a method that you like best. The important thing to remember is that just because you like a method doesn't mean that it is going to work on every dog. Every situation is different so being able to adapt to your dogs needs is key.