Training with tethered pigeons

[wberry85]

Question on the process for training with a tethered pigeon:

After you launch or flush the bird, the bird will fly away, and then land. The dog will hold point still (hopefully).

What do you do in this situation? If you release the dog, he will go after the downed bird. I will have him on a cc but is it a bad message to pull the dog off the bird after it is flushed and downed?

If you or a partner go and retrieve the downed bird, is that a bad message for the dog? I am sure they will be confused and put a lot of pressure on him to hold.

Is there a good way to release the dog, praise him, and move on to the next bird without losing the pigeon?

[Ricky Ticky Shorthairs]

Keep the lead in your hands, and once the bird lands give a tug on the lead and command here at the same time, and go 180 degrees away from the bird. Then on to the next.

Doug

[wberry85]

Is it bad if the dog gets no reward out of pointing the bird?

[Ricky Ticky Shorthairs]

For a broke dog the shot or fall is the reward. You can let him retrieve every now and then if he's starting to sour. During the breaking process, the more he retrieves the harder it will be to get him broke.

Doug

[DonF]

Is it bad if the dog gets no reward out of pointing the bird?

yep, walk it away 180*. But before you do, give the dog a pat and a good word. First time, and the last, I worked a dog on tethered birds, rather than walk it away, I picked it up and carried it away. I don't like tethered birds but a lot of people do. Where that might be good is finishing out the broke dog but the bird that removes all temptation is the one that fly's off. That said, later on in training, depending on the finish you want, a bird hitting the ground and walking around for the dog can be real good. But I can do that by simply pulling flight feather's and tossing a bird on the ground. Funny thing about that is we teach the dog to do exactly what we don't want the young dog to do; sight point!

[Sharon]

Question on the process for training with a tethered pigeon:

After you launch or flush the bird, the bird will fly away, and then land. The dog will hold point still (hopefully).

What do you do in this situation? If you release the dog, he will go after the downed bird. I will have him on a cc but is it a bad message to pull the dog off the bird after it is flushed and downed?

If you or a partner go and retrieve the downed bird, is that a bad message for the dog? I am sure they will be confused and put a lot of pressure on him to hold.

Is there a good way to release the dog, praise him, and move on to the next bird without losing the pigeon?

.....................................

I don't care about losing a pigeon. You're talking about a couple dollars a bird for a couple months at the most of pigeons. I want that dizzied/launched bird to fly away hard and that dog to hold , (on a CC initially). Frees me to stroke the dog/praise. Later I move on to shooting the bird and the retrieve. Have never clipped or tethered and have been successful.

PS
Actually I did tie on a piece of hose once. The bird flew off anyways and landed in a tree on an island hanging from the hose. At this time the "Bird Watching Club" came by on the other side of the pond. :roll: True story.

[wberry85]

I'll try it this weekend but something tells me its going to be hard to get my dog to just forget about the downed bird. I am betting he is going to be pulling the heck out of me to get to the spot he saw it go down.

[AZ Brittany Guy]

I'll try it this weekend but something tells me its going to be hard to get my dog to just forget about the downed bird. I am betting he is going to be pulling the heck out of me to get to the spot he saw it go down.

No doubt he will. But when you check cord him to another bird he will be less likely to fight you on leaving the downed bird.

[RayGubernat]

I will use tethered pigeons or chuckars, but more for "proofing".

I have the birds tethered to a long (25-30') length of nylon mason cord that is attached to a horseshoe. The bird gets up and flies and when it reaches the end of the string it comes down in a heap. Just about the time the bird gets to the end of the string I fire the gun. If the dog does not move through wing shot and fall, I got 'em where I want. Then I heel the dog away. The bird experience ends up and turns into an obedience situation. You heel the dog away because you are done with that bird. The dog needs to understand that since you are done...it is also done with that bird. Thus the obedience situation.

...Next bird....

A pat on the flank and a quiet "good dog" is all the reward they should get. They need to know you are pleased and that they did it right. You did it right... you did what was expected of you...I am pleased with you.... Almost matter of fact...but not quite. That is all the dog needs. No less...but no more. Anything more than that and the dog might get over-excited and mess up on the next opportunity because of the excessive attention.

Think of it this way...that is the dog's job. You expect someone to do their job right...because it is their job. A simple "good job", is all the recognition that can be expected. It is the same with a bird dog. It is what they do. It is their job.

RayG

[DonF]

I will use tethered pigeons or chuckars, but more for "proofing".

I have the birds tethered to a long (25-30') length of nylon mason cord that is attached to a horseshoe. The bird gets up and flies and when it reaches the end of the string it comes down in a heap. Just about the time the bird gets to the end of the string I fire the gun. If the dog does not move through wing shot and fall, I got 'em where I want. Then I heel the dog away. The bird experience ends up and turns into an obedience situation. You heel the dog away because you are done with that bird. The dog needs to understand that since you are done...it is also done with that bird. Thus the obedience situation.

...Next bird....

A pat on the flank and a quiet "good dog" is all the reward they should get. They need to know you are pleased and that they did it right. You did it right... you did what was expected of you...I am pleased with you.... Almost matter of fact...but not quite. That is all the dog needs. No less...but no more. Anything more than that and the dog might get over-excited and mess up on the next opportunity because of the excessive attention.

Think of it this way...that is the dog's job. You expect someone to do their job right...because it is their job. A simple "good job", is all the recognition that can be expected. It is the same with a bird dog. It is what they do. It is their job.

RayG

Got a question Ray, Why would you tether a pigeon to do that? Why not just flush and let it return home? A game bird i can understand.

[gonehuntin']

I'll try it this weekend but something tells me its going to be hard to get my dog to just forget about the downed bird. I am betting he is going to be pulling the heck out of me to get to the spot he saw it go down.

It's called dog training. Hunting when you miss a bird you won't want him chasing the bird all over the fields will you?

This simply teaches them that they can't chase a bird and have to go where you want, not where they want.

[RayGubernat]

I will use tethered pigeons or chuckars, but more for "proofing".

I have the birds tethered to a long (25-30') length of nylon mason cord that is attached to a horseshoe. The bird gets up and flies and when it reaches the end of the string it comes down in a heap. Just about the time the bird gets to the end of the string I fire the gun. If the dog does not move through wing shot and fall, I got 'em where I want. Then I heel the dog away. The bird experience ends up and turns into an obedience situation. You heel the dog away because you are done with that bird. The dog needs to understand that since you are done...it is also done with that bird. Thus the obedience situation.

...Next bird....

A pat on the flank and a quiet "good dog" is all the reward they should get. They need to know you are pleased and that they did it right. You did it right... you did what was expected of you...I am pleased with you.... Almost matter of fact...but not quite. That is all the dog needs. No less...but no more. Anything more than that and the dog might get over-excited and mess up on the next opportunity because of the excessive attention.

Think of it this way...that is the dog's job. You expect someone to do their job right...because it is their job. A simple "good job", is all the recognition that can be expected. It is the same with a bird dog. It is what they do. It is their job.

RayG

Got a question Ray, Why would you tether a pigeon to do that? Why not just flush and let it return home? A game bird i can understand.

I find that the bird coming down in a heap as I fire the gun is am powerful temptation. The bird fluttering on the ground, which also happens often, is even more of a temptation for the dog to break.

Also, I use ferals for the most part and this way, I get to use the bird again and it saves me time as well. All I have to do is reset it in the trap or kick cage and bring on the next dog.

By doing it this way, I can have a dog that is reasonably steady and styled up...all the way through fall. Since I don't do retrieving stakes, that means the dog is always one level more steady than I should need in a trial.

I have only seen a planted quail kill itself once at a trial, but I do know it happens every now and then. The bird flew into a telephone pole and fell out of the sky... dead as a stone. The dog broke. It was not my dog, but the way my luck runs, it will happen to me, sooner or later.

RayG

[jimbo&rooster]

[quote="DonF[/quote]

Got a question Ray, Why would you tether a pigeon to do that? Why not just flush and let it return home? A game bird i can understand.[/quote]


I started to use tethered pigieons, because I found that FT quail have a tendency to only "hop" about 20-30ft on the flush and I not only want my dog to see that happen, but it also gives me the opportunity to work on delayed chase.

Jim

[Sharon]

double post - wouldn't delete

[Sharon]

RayG[/quote]

Got a question Ray, Why would you tether a pigeon to do that? Why not just flush and let it return home? A game bird i can understand.[/quote]

I find that the bird coming down in a heap as I fire the gun is am powerful temptation. The bird fluttering on the ground, which also happens often, is even more of a temptation for the dog to break.

Also, I use ferals for the most part and this way, I get to use the bird again and it saves me time as well. All I have to do is reset it in the trap or kick cage and bring on the next dog.

By doing it this way, I can have a dog that is reasonably steady and styled up...all the way through fall. Since I don't do retrieving stakes, that means the dog is always one level more steady than I should need in a trial.

I have only seen a planted quail kill itself once at a trial, but I do know it happens every now and then. The bird flew into a telephone pole and fell out of the sky... dead as a stone. The dog broke. It was not my dog, but the way my luck runs, it will happen to me, sooner or later.

RayG[/quote]

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As someone who has always let the bird fly off, this explanation is new to me and makes a lot of sense. Have to think on that. Thanks.