Dog creeping on birds?

Dieseldog8 · Post by **Dieseldog8** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:05 pm

Hey guys I have a question on teaching my 2 year old gsp. In the field I run him and a 4 yr black lab one a point dog and other flushing dog. Well My pointer will hold on points until people start walking up near him or towards the bird he will wanna creep. But then also he will hold great until I send my flush dog in and then my pointer seems to get jealous and wants the birds for himself. Now when hes on point and steady Ill walk up to him tell him good boy and rub his belly and hold him and keep repeating whoa but then the flish dog comes in and he wants to bolt at the birds. What is something I can do to make him steadier? Any advice would be helpful thanks guys!

campgsp · Post by **campgsp** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:53 pm

I would run the gsp separate until he is honest on his birds.
He is confused as to what his actual job is.

deseeker · Post by **deseeker** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:16 pm

campgsp wrote:I would run the gsp separate until he is honest on his birds.
He is confused as to what his actual job is.

X2---I would not use the lab with him until he is older and completely broke on his birds(IMO)

I'd also have the people flushing walk in from the side so the dog can see what's going on. A lot of times when you walk by a young dog, you are encouraging him to walk in with you. Don't shoot any birds he creeps on---if you do you are rewarding him for going in. Get a launcher and pigeons & launch the pigeons the minute he moves or looks around---don't fire a gun when you launch them--let him think it was his fault the birds left.

Work on whoa in the yard WITH NO BIRDS and get him where he'll let you walk around him without him moving. He needs to get use to you walking in front of him kicking and throwing stuff(distractions) with out moving, before you can do it while he's pointing.

gonehuntin' · Post by **gonehuntin'** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:39 pm

X3. A GSP is a great retriever by itself. You probably don't need the lab. I'd hunt them totally separate for now.

RoostersMom · Post by **RoostersMom** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:42 pm

Agree with above, he's not whoa broke - but that can be remedied by teaching him whoa. I would not run the two together either for now. It's hard for a dog to be steady when another one is in there getting his birds. When we work on backing drills (similar problem...sort of) we try to give the backing dog a retrieve every so often, so that he does get to have the reward of a retrieve.

Back to the basics with your boy though - teach him whoa OFF of birds and then transition him to birds. The best method I've seen of doing this is in the Perfect Start/Perfect Finish DVD series. I even sent my dog to Perfection to help with his creeping issue as well - they just reinforced the whoa with a ton of birds finally, and we were good to go (at least we've been good to go for the last 5 years since).

Post by **slistoe** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:53 pm

Get rid of the Lab till you have taught and proofed the manners on your dog. The GSP will be much more jealous of another dog taking "his" birds than his master. Once he is comfortable with standing for you, your buddy and everything else under the sun then bring your Lab back into the picture.

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:32 pm

Well we all say the same thing. Once you put up the lab, quit going to your dog. Go wide of him and keep your eye on him and your mouth shut. You said you do whoa hum when he start's to creep. Does he stop? If he does, when you give the whoa command you stop immediately, don't race him to the bird. How are you keeping the bird down during all this? If you have a remote launcher, don't say whoa. Stop immediately and pop the bird. If you have a manual trap you really should get someone to help you. You handle your dog on a check cord and the other guy works the bird. If you used the whoa post to teach whoa, you can go wide around the dog and if it moves, you stop, give the command and bump the dog under the chin with the knot holding the snap on. Put a bunch of though into what your doing, you might surprise yourself and come up with something that works for you on your own. Get the original Delmar Smith book. It will teach you how to train with just the check cord. If the book has you using a waist collar on the whoa training, it's not the original book. You need the original book.

will-kelly · Post by **will-kelly** » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:32 am

Too much pressure on the pointer. I would also venture to guess that you continue to shoot the birds that the dog brakes on.

It's not only confusing to the dog but the natural instinct to get the bird in its mouth is being rewarded by the poor behavior.

You need to train the pointer to work the way you want the pointer to work. If you want him to run around willy-nilly with a Labrador in the field and then all of a sudden lock up with the style and grace of an American Field Champion then you need to start with the basics.

The older the dog gets the harder it is going to be to break the old habits.

crackerd · Post by **crackerd** » Tue Feb 04, 2014 8:27 am

Yeah, and anyhow, Labs are a little more assertive than creeping when they want a bird before another dog can get it...

MG

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