What are the dangers of incorrect e-collar use?

[chrokeva]

After much debate with myself and research I have decided to collar condition my 7 month old FBECS. I did not take this decision lightly and have done my research. I have a trainer that has agreed to walk me through the process and I feel that I have taken and will continue to take all the steps to make sure this a good experience for me and my dog.
At the same time my neighbor has a completely out of control akita cross that is approx. 14 months old. They have had nothing but problems with this dog as it escapes and runs off does not listen at all off leash and cannot be controlled on a leash. This dog has no clue how to act and as dog owners these people are just clueless. They now risk being evicted as they have been given a warning that is the dog is not kept under control they will need to leave. So next thing I see they have put a e-collar on the dog. Of course no collar conditioning was given to this dog and clearly the dog has absolutely no obedience. The dog (off leash) ran up on my dog this morning and the owner zapped the dog on what I figure must have been a very high setting as the dogs hackles went up and it ran away from my dog. So I am wondering what is the likely hood of the e-collar working for this dog? and what is the worse case scenario for this dog going forward?
I know that I will be using this training tool in a very different manner than these people but I am a bit embarrassed that the uneducated general public will paint us in the same light.

[gundogguy]

After much debate with myself and research I have decided to collar condition my 7 month old FBECS. I did not take this decision lightly and have done my research. I have a trainer that has agreed to walk me through the process and I feel that I have taken and will continue to take all the steps to make sure this a good experience for me and my dog.
At the same time my neighbor has a completely out of control akita cross that is approx. 14 months old. They have had nothing but problems with this dog as it escapes and runs off does not listen at all off leash and cannot be controlled on a leash. This dog has no clue how to act and as dog owners these people are just clueless. They now risk being evicted as they have been given a warning that is the dog is not kept under control they will need to leave. So next thing I see they have put a e-collar on the dog. Of course no collar conditioning was given to this dog and clearly the dog has absolutely no obedience. The dog (off leash) ran up on my dog this morning and the owner zapped the dog on what I figure must have been a very high setting as the dogs hackles went up and it ran away from my dog. So I am wondering what is the likely hood of the e-collar working for this dog? and what is the worse case scenario for this dog going forward?
I know that I will using this training tool in a very different manner than these people but I am a bit embarrassed that the uneducated general public will paint us in the same light.

As a herding dog maven and aficionado, you really should get together with Gary Brietbart and not get that type of information from folks that have never seen you or your dog work together. The sensitivities involve in intro to e-collar for a spaniel training one must proceed on a well known path to success. If you lived in Michigan I could show you how but my training classes are a wee bit of a commute!

[chrokeva]

Huh?? Not sure what you are talking about gundogguy
I was asking about our neighbor that is using this on there untrained dog. I was not asking about my dog. Perhaps my question was not clear enough?

[EvanG]

Please bear in mind that you can do extensive damage to any dog with any aversive, if improperly used. An angry verbal tirade, or a rolled up newspaper can be abused and cause lasting damage to some dogs. You're approaching this correctly by seeking out experienced guidance. The modern e-collar is the finest, most efficient tool we have at our disposal when we follow sound practice.

EvanG

[Sharon]

[quote="chrokeva"] So next thing I see they have put a e-collar on the dog. Of course no collar conditioning was given to this dog and clearly the dog has absolutely no obedience. The dog (off leash) ran up on my dog this morning and the owner zapped the dog on what I figure must have been a very high setting as the dogs hackles went up and it ran away from my dog. So I am wondering what is the likely hood of the e-collar working for this dog? and what is the worse case scenario for this dog going forward?

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May very likely create a fear biter - anxious, confused,lashes out- which is a horror story for any dog , let alone an Akita. Sad.

PS A problem with forums is that folks often don't read the original post.

[chrokeva]

Thank you Sharon for getting my question back on track.
I was afraid that fear biting could result from this as I am sure the dog is completely confused. I feel very bad for this dog but am also afraid of what the dog may do to other dogs and people out of fear and confusion

[gundogguy]

Huh?? Not sure what you are talking about gundogguy
I was asking about our neighbor that is using this on there untrained dog. I was not asking about my dog. Perhaps my question was not clear enough?

My bad, though, the more I thought about it how could I place judgment on your neighbors dog I have never seen it. Especially seeing that the sequence came on the heels of you speaking about using the e-collar to assist you in training your cocker.
Remember dogs are still considered chattel property in the eyes of the law, and as our property it is our right to do,use,or treat them just about any way the owner of the property sees fit. In end we all get the dog we deserve. ...That may be a good thin that may be not so good.
Please excuse for the misunderstanding!

[RoostersMom]

First off, it's an Akita - a dog well known for stubbornness and very likely to have dog aggressive tendencies. Any collar correction used to break up or prevent fights often causes the dog getting the shock to aggressively attack the other dog. Don't ask how I know this, we'll just say I've learned a lot about how to appropriately use an e-collar in the last 10 years.

Your neighbor's best bet is to enroll in a GOOD obedience class or get private lessons from someone who will be able to work one-on-one with them and the dog.

As for the future of this dog.....it's an Akita. Look up the breed. I can think of very few poorer breed choices for a non dog-savvy owner.

[chrokeva]

I can see how my post was confusing since I went straight from my pup into the neighbors.
I also understand it is there dog and there choice. I would not want to tell them what to do with there dog anymore than I want someone telling me what to do with mine. Having said that I still have concerns as they are allowing this dog to run loose and it is running up on me and my dogs as well as other people and there dogs so the concern is also one of safety. I will just have to TRY to keep a wide berth with this dog until we see how things progress and keep my fingers crossed that the dog does not escalate to aggressiveness.

[DonF]

What is an FBECS?

[Sharon]

Bred for the field- not the couch- English Cocker Spaniel

[polmaise]

Does that mean it was bred in a field ,or conceived in a field?...Or A Couch?

[fuzznut]

Since you are working with a trainer, could you ask that trainer if he would do a one on one with your neighbor and the dogs? Collar conditioning is collar conditioning regardless of the breed.

I would also be very careful having your dog around this dog if the neighbor is just going to start zapping the poor beast. The Akita could well think it's your dog, or you, causing it's pain..... and it could attack just out of confusion and pain.

This is what gives collars a bad name... I feel for the dog! He has no clue what is being asked of him and has no clue how to make it stop.