Hunt with or without e collar

[Epp838]

I have a young vizsla, she a little over a year old. She recalls great with or with out the e collar, follows commands etc. never been any issues with obedience. I've been really working on her whoa training and holding steady until shot. Some times she holds great then sometimes she doesn't so I have to use the collar.

My biggest complaint about her is that she stays a little to close when hunting, she normally ranges around 30-50 yards depends on cover. I really would like to she her range around 75-100 yards. Well today after I thought we were done hunting I took her collar off as I was packing up getting ready to leave. I look up and she's on point about 80 yards out and was holding nicely. So I grabbed my gun and went to her and got a single. After that she was working out around 100 yards without her collar, which I think is ideal. FYI when its on I rarely use it and its not gps.

So my question is do you always put a E collar while hunting? Do you think I should try hunting her without to see if her range increases or do you think I should continue to use it until i get her fully trained to hold until shot? It seems like she also runs better and harder without.

[randomnut]

Definitely no expert here with little experience. I use the collar only for recall while hunting my year old pup. I do not shock while hunting, I just let the pup hunt and figure things out on his own. He points great, and I'll work on steady after season. His range has improved a bunch through this first season. Starting around 50-75 yards at first, and now hunts out to about 150-200, and checks in frequently.

[ezzy333]

Your dog is telling you that you are using it too much in the field most likely. The problem is an example of why we teach in the yard and have the collar on as an insurance policy in a dangerous situation. You are using it for one reason but she is thinking it is for ranging too far when she finds a bird and points,

[Sharon]

My setter doesn't need the e collar anymore for anything. ( I'm such a great trainer. ) However she always wears it for the locator feature, as we can't use GPS units up here.
Also useful for trash breaking still. What will you do if your dog takes off after a deer and has no e collar one?

[shags]

Your dog is telling you that you are using it too much in the field most likely. The problem is an example of why we teach in the yard and have the collar on as an insurance policy in a dangerous situation. You are using it for one reason but she is thinking it is for ranging too far when she finds a bird and points,

^^^ This^^^^

[gonehuntin']

Never, ever, take the collar off the dog or the dog will become collar wise. The range issue will work itself out. Most new pointing dog trainers are uncomfortable with their dog's ranging out so are always re-calling them, hence the range issue. Let her roll and keep your mouth shut. The collar is the greatest safety device ever invented for dog's and the most humane and precise training aid. My dog's NEVER run without an collar on, even on fun walks.

[Epp838]

Thanks for the advice. I never recall her unless she's getting herself into trouble. Hopefully it does work itself out. She gets a little bolder ever hunt.

[BigTub]

The collar was for my peace of mind more than anything. Several times I found out after the fact, that I forgot to turn it on. When I got my 2nd set of e-collars that had the little tone, I almost exclusively used the tone function after that -- dogs hated the loud beeper. The only time I found that the shock necessary was on chasing furry game.

[Vernal Pike]

Sharon,

You can't use GPS in Canada?
Please explain

[Sharon]

Illegal.
I'm no techie but something to do with the .........being the same as that used for emergency vehicles. Always a fight with the govt. going on to get them allowed. Lots of hunters use them anyway, but apparently there's a problem if you have to send it in to get it fixed/upgraded - you may not get it sent back to Canada. Many use an American friend intermediary. Sport Dog Tek is legal here.
I don't have a GPS unit ; having worked in the jail and probation/parole for 20 years I have a thing about following the law.

** Americans that come to Canada for trials can use them . Regular trial rules for GPS use.

[CDN_Cocker]

You should definitely continue to hunt her with the collar if she is not finished. However, it sounds like you are using the collar too much. Maybe the next time you take her out put the collar on and leave the remote in the truck so you are not tempted to nitpick. Sounds like she's losing confidence due to too many corrections.

[Epp838]

I've gotten several response's about using the ecollar too much but I don't thinks its really the case. For example i used it twice over a 2-2 1/2 hr hunt, which both times it was because she chased a flushed bird. And she's not really sensitive to commands or the collar. I live in a neighborhood in the city so obedience is a must which she is really good with, I'm thinking it may carry over to the field and assumes shes not suppose to roam that far since she cant while at home. I try to take her on long walks /runs in different fields a few times a week.

Even when were out on fun runs with no collar she likes to stay close and with in 40-50 yards of me. About every 5 minutes she looks up to find where I'm at, if I'm to far away from her (in her mind) she runs to me within a few feet then back out she goes. Without any commands it seems she just likes to check in with me. I don't think I could run off and leave her if i tried. Hunting is a little different she likes to stay in her comfort zone but she hunts hard just close, but I would have to physically remove her once shes on a bird.

[ezzy333]

I think everyone answer you question the way you framed it to the best of their ability. It is always hard when we haven't seen the dog or fully understand what you might be calling close or far. I do think we all gave you the reason a dog works closer or seems to know when they have the collar on. 99 out of 100 says it is being used too much and for the wrong reason. Granted, that may not be true in you5r case, and if that is true we are back at square one. Just as a sidelight, my dogs had their collars on 99% of the time and I can think of twice in the past three years I used it in the field. However, it did get used more often in the yard. When a dog chased and if I wanted to stop that, I did not use the collar, but rather worked on that problem the next day when I was training at home. There are always side effects to everything we do and it is up to you to decide what and how you want to solve a problem. Asking here on the forum was a good start. Listening and accepting the answers are a good second step. Trying what is advised is a good third step. Noticing if there is a difference after trying it for a few weeks and then deciding if it helped or hindered is a good forth step. and finally coming back and reporting is a good and courteous fifth step. All of this results in a possible improvement in your dog even though you would have sworn it wouldn't help or you still have the problem and we all need to try and figure something else to do. Either way we tried and that is step number one to conquering.

Ezzy