GWP vs PUG

[adamvol]

Hello,
I am a new member but have been reading these forums for almost 2 years in anticipation of getting my first bird dog. I now have a 13 week old German Wirehair Pointer that I have had since he was 6 weeks old. I am trying to work on discipline before starting to work with birds based on some of the information from this site.

The issue I am having is I also have a 12 year old PUG. The PUG has been through a lot but gets around pretty well for her age. The GWP wants to play with the PUG and she wants no part of him period. This doesn't appear to be normal play to me the GWP tries to pin the PUG at times want wants to stand over the PUG and bite her back.

The PUG has bitten the GWP no less than 10-12 times. Based on everything I've read, I thought letting this play out would be the best option because the GWP would learn not to harass the PUG since she has bitten him and somewhat takes up for herself. This is not the case, the GWP is relentless in his pursuit of the PUG and has not let up one bit even after getting bitten multiple times.

Now I admit I have likely made the situation worse by yelling, swatting and doing whatever I can to keep the GWP off the pug which only seems to intensify the situation. I honestly think the PUG would take up for herself even more but me getting involved has made her think she needs to submit and let the pup do what he wants. I just cannot sit by and let him hurt the PUG whether its accidental or not.

I would appreciate any advise on how to handle the situation. Do you think the GWP would purposely hurt the PUG or is he just being a normal puppy? He does seem frustrated that the PUG wants nothing to do with him.

[adamvol]

Sorry I meant to mention the GWP seems to be stalking the small dog a lot. I believe that's an important point, never owning one of these dogs I just don't know what to make of it.

[GmanHawaii]

I would keep them apart, your pug is 12, too old and soon to be too small to keep up with you GWP. My 9 week old GSP is not allowed to play with my 3 year GSP yet, puppies aren't to bright, they will do stupid stuff that will get them in trouble with the older dog. After about 4-5 months of age i will let my two play together supervised. At that age at least the pup will be big enough when the older dog pulls her puppy card.

Your pug is the senior dog and at that age probably justvwants to go about his or her normal day and will have no patience for the pup.

[Steve007]

Your wirehair will not ever hurt your Pug on purpose, but young wires are rambunctiouus and frequently clumsy. It may do so by accident. I'd follow the previous poster's advice if you can. The Pug will straighten our your wire eventually, but meanwhile the pup could genuinely hurt him just out of brainlessness.

Stand by your Pug. (Is this a song?)

[Sharon]

Nothing to do with it being a GWP. Very common problem for all breeds.
I have a 11 year old dog and the 3 year old likes to harass her. I supervise closely or keep them apart. The 11 year old now sleeps in a crate overnight , or when I'm away, so she has a sense of being safe from "bullies"

[shags]

If the pug is physically able, let her rearrange that pup's face. If at 12 she can't protect herself, or is too kind/soft to do it, step in. My terrier as a pup harrassed my old setter until finally one day the old girl just had up to here, and it was ON for a minute or two. A couple of years later, my youngest setter also bullied that even older dog, who by that time was too feeble to stick up for herself. So I intervened with a good hard shaking and "leave it!". Young dogs have to learn respect one way or the other. In our second case, the setter pup learned that there is one Queen Blitch in this house, and it isn't him

For both situations, we did as Sharon says, and kept the pups and old dog separated when we weren't there to supervise.
The terrier learned her lesson, and the setter needed an occasional verbal warning until he outgrew being so obnoxious to our old girl. Up until she died, the old dog often shared the sofa or her dog bed with the brats, so apparently no hard feelings lingered.

Good luck to you and your crew.

[Spyro]

Hello,
I am a new member but have been reading these forums for almost 2 years in anticipation of getting my first bird dog. I now have a 13 week old German Wirehair Pointer that I have had since he was 6 weeks old. I am trying to work on discipline before starting to work with birds based on some of the information from this site.

The issue I am having is I also have a 12 year old PUG. The PUG has been through a lot but gets around pretty well for her age. The GWP wants to play with the PUG and she wants no part of him period. This doesn't appear to be normal play to me the GWP tries to pin the PUG at times want wants to stand over the PUG and bite her back.

The PUG has bitten the GWP no less than 10-12 times. Based on everything I've read, I thought letting this play out would be the best option because the GWP would learn not to harass the PUG since she has bitten him and somewhat takes up for herself. This is not the case, the GWP is relentless in his pursuit of the PUG and has not let up one bit even after getting bitten multiple times.

Now I admit I have likely made the situation worse by yelling, swatting and doing whatever I can to keep the GWP off the pug which only seems to intensify the situation. I honestly think the PUG would take up for herself even more but me getting involved has made her think she needs to submit and let the pup do what he wants. I just cannot sit by and let him hurt the PUG whether its accidental or not.

I would appreciate any advise on how to handle the situation. Do you think the GWP would purposely hurt the PUG or is he just being a normal puppy? He does seem frustrated that the PUG wants nothing to do with him.

I don't have anything to add about the Pug issue but I will add this, I prefer to error heavily on the side of birds over formal obedience in young dogs. In my humble opinion, the most important part of puppyhood is fostering a healthy bond and developing bird drive. Too much obedience at a young age can inhibit both of those.

For example, I have a 16 month old shorthair, that just went RU at the National Futurity in October, and he isn't going to be formally broke until next month. To this point in his life, everything has been focused on getting him confidence to run and bird drive.

While horseback competition dogs are the extreme end of the spectrum, my best piece of advice is to put a recall on your puppy (I'll even overlay the whistle and collar beep by 4 months) and have it on birds as much as possible. Get the drive through the roof and then put the brakes on him.

Best of luck and enjoy!

[GSPONPOINT32]

I have an 8 year old retired greyhound who is very shy and was not socialized with other breeds at a young age...for obvious reasons. Got my GSP 1 year ago. We kept them seperatee for about two months with a baby gate. After that he was big enough and had been socialized to know somewhat what was acceptable. He jumped up at her twice before she snapped at him...never again. He tried to eat her food once...she fixed that in one snap. They have been buddies ever since running and playing in the yard. She lets him know when he is out of control or when he needs to give her space with a growl and he hasn't been snapped at in a few months now. I can understand the frustration as it was difficult having two separate dog areas in the house but I'm sure everything will work out. A pug is much smaller than a greyhound so I'm sure there are additional complications with that. Good luck and happy training. Best decision I've ever made.


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[Sharon]

If the pug is physically able, let her rearrange that pup's face. If at 12 she can't protect herself, or is too kind/soft to do it, step in. My terrier as a pup harrassed my old setter until finally one day the old girl just had up to here, and it was ON for a minute or two. A couple of years later, my youngest setter also bullied that even older dog, who by that time was too feeble to stick up for herself. So I intervened with a good hard shaking and "leave it!". Young dogs have to learn respect one way or the other. In our second case, the setter pup learned that there is one Queen Blitch in this house, and it isn't him

For both situations, we did as Sharon says, and kept the pups and old dog separated when we weren't there to supervise.
The terrier learned her lesson, and the setter needed an occasional verbal warning until he outgrew being so obnoxious to our old girl. Up until she died, the old dog often shared the sofa or her dog bed with the brats, so apparently no hard feelings lingered.

Good luck to you and your crew.

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That makes 2 of us. LOL

[Gator_McClusky]

They will learn to live together. My male GWP was raised with a 5 lbs female Chihuahua. They get along just fine. Chihuahua has like seven teeth and will give play bites on the GWP. GWP just takes it and just play bumps her around. Has never shown any aggression. Early on I had to monitor them and occassionally break it up when the GWP got too rough (would drag the Chihuahau by her tail).

I think it actually helped with reinforcing a soft mouth. The big dog learned to play gingerly with small creatures and has never once crunched a bird.

[adamvol]

I really appreciate everyone's replies. I will follow your advise and keep them separated unless we're supervising. I also got them both a bully stick which keeps them away from one another. It's going to be a tough few months as the GWP gets bigger. The pug is only 13lbs she was the runt of the litter. Thanks again