Another dog eats pen raised quail "?"

[VAsetter]

Ok .. Let me start as I'm new too raising training setters . I have a male 1 year old . We worked last fall and they February on just introducing him too woods and smells of pen raised birds . That I clipped too much Wing .. Wouldn't fly real good .. He would just put his paw on them after he chased them down .. Now too present . Went and got 10 new birds .. Bird 1 was dizzied just not Enuf an when he hit the ground he went running too the woodline.. Went and got the dog .. He tracked it a hollow root stump .. Bird went out back door and flew . . We tried too track 2 nd time but too no avail .. Any way I praised his efforts and we walked back too the kennel .. Now yesterday .. I go too feed birds and water .. 1 is dead in the cage .. I decided that I would try too get him too retrieve .. He's excited .. Sees and smells that I have bird .. I throw bird out and he bolts too it .. Picks it up then it's play time .. I have the check cord and trying too bring him back too me I calling here .. He starts too swallow the bird .. Feet are the only thing hanging out his mouth .. I'm physically prying the bird out his while steping on his foot trying too make him let go.. Any suggestions on where too go from here . I have a shock collar and launcher . I have not used either ..I've basically been doing about 6 months " of show " pups from the Hickok vhs tapes . I realize there is the time for stimulation stage now . But I'm a lil worried about the process of what's nezt

[cjhills]

Ok .. Let me start as I'm new too raising training setters . I have a male 1 year old . We worked last fall and they February on just introducing him too woods and smells of pen raised birds . That I clipped too much Wing .. Wouldn't fly real good .. He would just put his paw on them after he chased them down .. Now too present . Went and got 10 new birds .. Bird 1 was dizzied just not Enuf an when he hit the ground he went running too the woodline.. Went and got the dog .. He tracked it a hollow root stump .. Bird went out back door and flew . . We tried too track 2 nd time but too no avail .. Any way I praised his efforts and we walked back too the kennel .. Now yesterday .. I go too feed birds and water .. 1 is dead in the cage .. I decided that I would try too get him too retrieve .. He's excited .. Sees and smells that I have bird .. I throw bird out and he bolts too it .. Picks it up then it's play time .. I have the check cord and trying too bring him back too me I calling here .. He starts too swallow the bird .. Feet are the only thing hanging out his mouth .. I'm physically prying the bird out his while steping on his foot trying too make him let go.. Any suggestions on where too go from here . I have a shock collar and launcher . I have not used either ..I've basically been doing about 6 months " of show " pups from the Hickok vhs tapes . I realize there is the time for stimulation stage now . But I'm a lil worried about the process of what's nezt

Do not use the collar when a bird is involved at this time. if you have the Hickok dvd use his method to collar condition the dog.
Pigeons in the launcher or wild birds that are not so easy to catch will help. Forget the quail for now.......Cj

[GSPONPOINT32]

I am also new. This forum has helped me a lot and I'm confident in where I'm at with my dog at this point because of a lot of good advice on here.
My experience:
Ditch the pheasants. I found that they ran and made my dog unsteady when he was starting to make good progress with other birds. We hunted state released pheasants in PA 8x and although it was a valuable experience for him the bird would run or fly before I could get to him most of the time. Some advice I got was to not shoot birds that flushed before I got in front so we went that route and left with an empty game bag several times.
Quail: good sized bird for the pup. Insist on quality or the dog will catch and never be steady. Use launchers
Pigeons: my pick. Find someone to catch or catch yourself. They always fly away. Strong scent. Cheapest option. Wear gloves when you handle them and the launcher to avoid scent contamination. I found that putting the launcher in some briers or very thick cover encouraged my dog to point and be steady. Nothing scientific here but just my observations from a rookie dog trainer. We do about 10 pigeons every other week and he's getting better and better. I also found that when I increased the number of birds he started figuring out the game so I cut it in half to keep him interested.

I planted my own pheasants (6) 3 weeks ago. NEVER AGAIN. Difficult to handle and expensive. I killed the first three over him because he did an excellent job. He saw the fourth one run and chased it. Tried to jump on 5 and 6.

He's back on pigeon probation ever since.

Good luck.


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[VAsetter]

Thanks , for the input .. I'm near a Downtown and the RR so I've see. The legions flying around .. I'll have too make me a trap and set it on my workplace roof

[Spyro]

Pigeons in the launcher or wild birds that are not so easy to catch will help. Forget the quail for now.......Cj

If a guy did nothing but what CJ recommended above and did it a lot, they'd end up with a heck of a good pointing dog.

Training a pointing dog is a lot like teaching a kid to ride a bicycle. It is all about allowing them to figure it out themselves. All they need is a gentle hand to guide them when necessary and to provide a safety net.

[DonF]

For the most part, pen raised game birds are a horrible bird to train dog's on. Some times they fly and some times not. And often they'll let the dog catch them. For getting a dog started, pigeon's are far and away my choice of bird! I would not use a dead bird that wasn't frozen to start a pu on retrieving. Use a training buck and a check cord. Early on the pup probably does want to play, the check cord get's it to do what you want. Teaching a pup to retrieve in the hall worked because there was no where to go other than back to you, think about that! From the buck I go to a frozen bird. Let it thaw about 20min or so and thaw out the feather's. A frozen bird won't be chomped in half and won't be played with a lot. Till the pup is bringing back the bird reliably, you still need the check cord. BTW, don't throw anything beyond the check cord to start. If the pup is picking up the bird slow, use the check cord to pull it off the bird and back to you. Then send it again. Won't be to long and the pup will snap the bird right off the ground. When you go to the fresh killed bird, the pup will stop and sniff at it, seem's like they all do. Don't allow that to long or often, drag it back with the check cord. I've never seen a dog eat a frozen quail!

[VAsetter]

Thanks , I talked too a dairy farmer today he said there should be plenty of piegons around the cylos by mid- December .. Any1 have a good piegon trap DIY plan .. Or probably just buy 1

[cjhills]

Thanks , I talked too a dairy farmer today he said there should be plenty of piegons around the cylos by mid- December .. Any1 have a good piegon trap DIY plan .. Or probably just buy 1

Beginning trappers don't generally have very good luck. some pigeon breeders are trying to cut down for winter and will sell them cheap now.......Cj

[GSPONPOINT32]

I never had luck with my traps. A fishing net and a headlamp at night was fairly easy in a barn.


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[oldbeek]

x 2 for pigeons only. In remote release traps if possible. Use a Tactical flashlight with the flashing led and the roosted pigeon will not move a muscle. Pigeons around a dairy have lots of food available. They will not go in a trap.