Solving bank cheat

[coastalquacker]

I've got a Boykin that will be a year old in November and she has just recently came back from going through force fetch with a pro. I do not know anyone who has done it and wanted to have it done by someone whos "been there done that". One problem that has arisen lately is her wanting to cheat the bank every chance she gets. She seems to have some kind of fear of jumping off a bank that does not gently slope into the water (not your typical Boykin water entry at all) and will cheat to where the bank slopes into the water to enter and return from the water there. Once she is in the water, she retrieves very nicely but it's her entering the water via cheating that makes it iffy. What is even stranger is that before she went through FF, I had her jumping from a Jon boat to retrieve and she hit the water just fine every time, no hesitation. We have not worked on lining or handling drills yet, so this may fix the problem but I wanted to ask and see if anyone has any ideas or drills I can run to try to both A) boost confidence in water entry on steeper banks and B) fix the bank cheat problem.

[polmaise]

What does the ''One that has done it before" advise you ? Give them, a call, they know the dog and you .
Yes, 'Lining and casting' on land is a must ,before 'Water' for sure.
Red Herrings of boats or launching boards or anything in situation of environments.
If you can ''Tap in" to this guy 'Dennis Voigt' , he can simplify to De-cheat them banks and have a confident entry ...and exit . Nice Scottish shirt in this video ,pity that 'Covid' restrictions just started before his planned visit to our shore.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWurLKGXjRY&t=146s

[gonehuntin']

If the dog won't be running field trial blinds, what difference does cheating make? Especially when hunting a river, straight lines are a detriment and not an asset.

[polmaise]

I can see ,running the bank an asset in Florida .but since the OP stated it was an issue to be resolved ........

[oregon woodsmoke]

I don't see what difference it makes as long as she will go into the water and retrieve from the water.

Leave it be, praise her for the retrieve and whatever the trainer did to frighten her will wear off as she gains confidence.

I love that big water entry, but it isnt safe. Unless you are competiting in dock diving, let her fetch the birds the way she is fetching the birds. Give her approval and she will speed it up as she goes along and has success.

[polmaise]

whatever the trainer did to frighten her will wear off as she gains confidence.

I must have missed some 'Intel'??
The OP and new to the board is only asking of a suggested training drill to address a specific issue in training .

[coastalquacker]

Thanks for the input guys. I want to run her in hunt tests and want her to complete water blinds so cheating the bank is a problem that needs to be resolved.
As far as the not wanting to jump from the bank, I’m not taking about a large dropoff but any type of bank that does not slope, she charges to the edge of the bank and hesitates before running down the bank to find an area that slopes into the water.
Thank you for the resources, I’ll check them out and try to work through them with her.

[nevermind]

Maybe vision problem...depth perception?

[SwitchGrassWPG]

Set it up so your dog has no choice but to enter straight in. Buy some plastic electric fence posts and plastic fencing to create a funnel for your send. Make the small end of the funnel large enough for you and the dog and extend it a few feet behind and a few feet into the water. You could even go the length of keeping some extra fence material on one side and pull it across the opening to dissuade going behind.

[polmaise]

Just a thought ?
If you started at the edge of the water at the point you asked entry to show the process' , there would be no requirement for fences or guides . The return back however , is all 'Re-call' and that is perfected on the land every day.
" she charges to the edge of the bank and hesitates before running down the bank to find an area that slopes into the water."

[Coveyrise64]

Like others I'm not a fan of big air entries. As long as she goes is all that matters. Since she has been FF I'd start with force to pile on land and then transfer that to the water. At the water start with short bumpers before extending the distance. Dead birds thrown short distances from the bank are another option. I'd rather see 6 short tosses retrieved as opposed to 1-2 long throws.

cr

[gonehuntin']

You should train using a retriever program if you want to run blinds with the dog. You can either teach a swim by or simply use angle decheats to train her. If you want a flying entry, you won't get a straight line.

[polmaise]

If you want a flying entry, you won't get a straight line.

Yea. Working on that return . lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sxtLqMxwrk

[gonehuntin']

Nice entry but far from a fine line.

[polmaise]

quacker,
"We have not worked on lining or handling drills yet, so this may fix the problem but I wanted to ask and see if anyone has any ideas or drills I can run to try to both A) boost confidence in water entry on steeper banks and B) fix the bank cheat problem."
lining drill will help with the entry, So will sending closer to the entry point you want... movimentum required, then accuratio will be achieved. Handling , like the 'Stop' whistle (pre-requisite),only when the dog is reliable on it helps ..Not! on the way out to achieve a Laser line in water, by handling it 'in' water....that can come later ,when momentum is achieved on entry and in water.
Only when the dog 'chooses' or decides' to run the bank on 'the other side' is the 'remote handling' such as 'Stop' and 're-call' ,required to show/teach the dog the route back .
Which ,what I was attempting to show in the previous clip ,before being judged on a finished performance of a dog in training .
It worked for this one and we don't even use collars. lol
If it works or helps you then great, if it doesn't , no matter , there will be no harm done . atb .