Need some advice

Dude · Post by **Dude** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:07 pm

My little setter (not quite a year old) is having a issue that I need some advice on. I'm afraid she's a bolter. When I work her on a check cord she does great. She comes when I call her or give a quick mouth whistle. What I need advice on is when I let her off the CC she just takes off and pays no attention to me what so ever. The worst episode was earlier this week. She was on the run for almost two days just running around the spread and hanging out but would not come when called or let me get close to her. She finally came to me when a big clap of thunder and lightning sent her running right to me and she sat down at my feet and buried her face in my crotch. I know that she needs time to run and explore but if she won't come when call I don't want to let her loose. I can't trust her. So back to the check cord I know but how do I transfer that to her being off the cc. I've thought about getting a e collar but I was wanting to try and train with out it. I figure if I can't get this right an e collar wouldn't make it any better. I have to admit I'm a little frustrated right now. This is my first bird dog I've tried to train and am wondering if I will be able to do it. Any advice?

Dude

cesarike · Post by **cesarike** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:32 pm

Sounds like the dog needs some obedience training.

She needs to understand that when you give her a command that she must obey it. This is essential not only for the dogs well being and safety but for her to be successfull as your hunting companion.

Post by **ezzy333** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:48 pm

Dogs can be trained without many tools we have found to be useful including the e-collar, CC, whistle etc. But I fail to understand why anyone would pick one of those tools out and say I don't want to use it.

You can spend weeks or months correcting the problem without using the collar or you can spend a day or two with it and them move on to other things. In my opinion there is no reason not to use it unless you can't afford it. Then I would try to rent or borrow one for a week or two.

I trained dogs for years without one but in all honesty the collar is probably the greatest tool yet for training. And probably the most humane way of treating the dog.

Ezzy

Don · Post by **Don** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:48 pm

She's only a year old and doing alright on the check cord, why are you letting her off it? Keep her on and condition her to a collar. Sounds to me like your testing and exactly what you think will happen does!

Dude · Post by **Dude** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:59 pm

Thanks for the replies. Keep them coming.
Its not that I am against using an ecollar it is that I wanted to try with out it because I thought that there was the possibility of doing more harm with my limited knowledge.

She needs to understand that when you give her a command that she must obey it. This is essential not only for the dogs well being and safety but for her to be successfull as your hunting companion.

I agree. I was hesitant about obedience training until after her first season. All I have really worked on is the come command on the cc. I was worried about messing up her hunting drive and independence. Am I wrong in this. My biggest fear is that I am going to do something to ruin her.

Dude

gonehuntin' · Post by **gonehuntin'** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:33 pm

Don't take the dog off the cc until you have 110% compliance, anywhere, anytime, anyplace, distractions and not. Your next step will be in a fenced in yard WHERE YOU CAN CATCH AND THROTTLE HER IF SHE DOESN'T COME. When she will come 100% of the time in the fenced in yard, take her outside with an 1/8th" braided cc, 6' long. You have a big problem now because YOU have taught her, that you can't catch her. Now the work starts. Remember the old and worn saying "Never give a dog a command you can't enforce". Think about that and follow it.

Don · Post by **Don** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:31 pm

gonehuntin' wrote:Don't take the dog off the cc until you have 110% compliance, anywhere, anytime, anyplace, distractions and not. Your next step will be in a fenced in yard WHERE YOU CAN CATCH AND THROTTLE HER IF SHE DOESN'T COME. When she will come 100% of the time in the fenced in yard, take her outside with an 1/8th" braided cc, 6' long. You have a big problem now because YOU have taught her, that you can't catch her. Now the work starts. Remember the old and worn saying "Never give a dog a command you can't enforce". Think about that and follow it.

Great post, right on the money. Your saying reminds me of another Delmar saying: "never let your dog tell you no!"

Margaret · Post by **Margaret** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:23 pm

She was on the run for almost two days just running around the spread and hanging out but would not come when called or let me get close to her

That sound odd. What did she do when you walked toward her and called her? For instance were her ears up and tail wagging?

thunderhead · Post by **thunderhead** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 8:49 pm

I can understand your not wanting to make a mistake with the ecollar. I would sugest that you find a dog training club near you or seak out a good pro that can help you get started and give you some training guidance. That will get you and your pup started on the right path. The collar will give you the capability to enforce those commands when she is at a distance. Timing of the correction is what will start to establish more consistancy in her complience.

Goosehunterdog · Post by **Goosehunterdog** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:48 am

gonehuntin' wrote:Don't take the dog off the cc until you have 110% compliance, anywhere, anytime, anyplace, distractions and not. Your next step will be in a fenced in yard WHERE YOU CAN CATCH AND THROTTLE HER IF SHE DOESN'T COME. When she will come 100% of the time in the fenced in yard, take her outside with an 1/8th" braided cc, 6' long. You have a big problem now because YOU have taught her, that you can't catch her. Now the work starts. Remember the old and worn saying "Never give a dog a command you can't enforce". Think about that and follow it.

Ditto,I am also glad to hear that you want to do the CC the right way.I would seekl a pro,join a club and I offer a book / manual called Total E-Collar conditioning by Mike lardy that shows step by step CC,FowlDawgs 1 DVD or Smartworks Volume 1 book by Evan Graham.I also have obidiance by Evan Graham DVD.You can see them at the site below if interested.I offer discount and free shipping.

Dude · Post by **Dude** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:59 am

gonehuntin' wrote:Don't take the dog off the cc until you have 110% compliance, anywhere, anytime, anyplace, distractions and not. Your next step will be in a fenced in yard WHERE YOU CAN CATCH AND THROTTLE HER IF SHE DOESN'T COME. When she will come 100% of the time in the fenced in yard, take her outside with an 1/8th" braided cc, 6' long. You have a big problem now because YOU have taught her, that you can't catch her. Now the work starts. Remember the old and worn saying "Never give a dog a command you can't enforce". Think about that and follow it.

I've read that and been told that and thought that I had been following that. When she bolted I didn't start hollering at her and shouting come. I just let her run cause I knew she wouldn't come to me and I didn't want her to learn that she didn't have to obey. I just didn't expect her to be gone as long as she was.

Margaret wrote:That sound odd. What did she do when you walked toward her and called her? For instance were her ears up and tail wagging?

Yeah she was happy tail wagging tongue lolling out. But when I'd get about 10 feet away she would just turn around and run

thanks for the replys

Dude