CRP needs the support of hunters

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mnaj_springer
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CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by mnaj_springer » Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:55 pm

http://crpworks.org/

I found this link on another forum. I signed it. I feel CRP is important for a lot of reasons but as an outdoorsman, hunter, and conservationist I support it. It takes 30 seconds to sign.

Ezzy, I wasn't sure where to put this so move it if you find a better place.
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by cjhills » Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:48 pm

Another liberal plan to mooch off the Government. Course they will have to throw rocks because they won't have Guns...................Cj

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by mnaj_springer » Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:23 pm

cjhills wrote:Another liberal plan to mooch off the Government. Course they will have to throw rocks because they won't have Guns...................Cj
Come on Cj... I know there are differences in opinion on this forum but this can be one of those political fronts that unites us. I'm willing to put aside differences for this cause. I hope others do the same.
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Tooling » Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:59 pm

Signed & supported

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by ezzy333 » Tue Aug 23, 2016 9:13 pm

CJ why do you call it a liberal program? I have never heard that before.
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CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Grommet » Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:16 am

I would not consider it a liberal program. The CRP and WREP are two of the best conservation programs this nation has ever put forth. Does it have flaws? Yes. Do some people exploit those flaws and game the system for personal gain? Yes. But without these two programs many game species would suffer as would our hunting heritage as a nation. I don't post very often especially not in regards to political squabbling but if you have a specific issue with CRP be specific. Don't just curse the whole program.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by mnaj_springer » Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:34 am

Thanks for moving this into the proper category Ezzy. I hope it gets enough exposure here!
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by ezzy333 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:12 am

mnaj_springer wrote:Thanks for moving this into the proper category Ezzy. I hope it gets enough exposure here!
Me too. It seems to not matter too much where ever it is but this just makes topics easier to find once they drop off of the active list. It is an important topic for hunters and farmers but I don't think most people understand how it works so maybe we can get more people informed.
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:34 am

Programs such as CRP, CREP or whatever has the greatest value re the water supply....game population(or hunter)aid is simply a secondary benefit....actually lower, imho.
For example, Pa. leads or led in CREP acerage....the Chesapeake Bay and it's flora/fauna should thank the CREP folks.

Hunters (and more :idea: ) should support set-aside programs......that support should include identical support for monitoring to avoid the ocassional abuse of the program.
It really is not all about game populations......from set-asides to raptors to forest health.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Tooling » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:47 am

In my view states should initiate periodic "raptor control" programs to counter the effect of urban sprawl and loss of habitat due to efficient farming as well...but that's a different subject altogether..

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by NEhomer » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:53 am

I'm so tempted to do my own raptor control when I see hawks and owls hovering over our stocked gun club!

Just signed the petition.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by cjhills » Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:26 pm

NEhomer wrote:I'm so tempted to do my own raptor control when I see hawks and owls hovering over our stocked gun club!

Just signed the petition.
Probably Northern Harriers working on your mouse population........Cj

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by oldbeek » Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:23 pm

All govt. farm programs had their start in the US Govt meddeling with exports. Example: You can not sell grain to Russia ( 1950s) Canada and Brazil went into mass grain production and sold to Russia. Killed the price of US grain. Result , grain subsidies. Oldbeek is a retired bee keeper. I have received honey subsidies. When the honey program was killed by Bill Clinton administration, US honey was selling for around $2.00 a pound. Now it is selling for $ 6.00 a pound. And Chinese honey is being bottled as local honey. 200 million pounds of table grade honey was sold last year. It cost the consumer $800 million more that they paid with the honey program in its last year. That program in its last year cost the tax payers $20 million dollars. Get the picture? No Honey program and you spend an extra $780 million for your honey. Oh Yea it may be antibiotic laced Chinese honey.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by cjhills » Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:31 pm

nothing else has went up in that time amazing that honey did.........Cj

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by ezzy333 » Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:57 pm

cjhills wrote:nothing else has went up in that time amazing that honey did.........Cj
here in the mid-west they reported honey went up because of the decline in bees and that sure makes sense. We have more rented hives for pollination than we do wild bees anymore.

I don't quite follow your thoughts on grain prices compared to honey. It sound like you are claiming the opposite for each corn prices dropped so they started the subsidy but when they quit the honey subsidy the prices went way high.

Even though the CRP works as a subsidy it really is the government renting marginally productive land and it helps erosion, over production, wildlife habitat, and is good for both farmer and hunter.

Ezzy
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by oldbeek » Thu Aug 25, 2016 2:54 pm

Yes bees are in short supply. That is because a few years after the honey program got cut, lots of beekeepers just quit. Beekeeping is not something you can learn from a book. It is very complex. I sold out just after that period. The price of a hive went to $225.oo ea for rent in pollination. That price started a stampeed for more hives across the nation. I have seen huge beekeepers splitting hive in the fall to send to CA pollination. When they die from to much of a split they are on TV saying they have colony colapse disease. In fact it was poor beekeeping. Lots of beginers are crashing because they do not give proper nutrition for their bees. That gets us back to CRP it is excellent nutrition for bees. I also have some marginal farm land in Indiana. Govt says i can not farm it so it is in CRP. Nice covey of bobs and some nice white tails in my adjoining woods.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:07 pm

The only problem I have with CRP is farmers posting crp land when they are on the government dole. A small portion of my tax money that I pay every year goes into that farmers pocket yet I can't enjoy my tax dollars at work.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:35 am

Vision wrote:The only problem I have with CRP is farmers posting crp land when they are on the government dole. A small portion of my tax money that I pay every year goes into that farmers pocket yet I can't enjoy my tax dollars at work.
CRP's(and the rest) purpose and importance is not hunting....that is a simple and wonderful side benefit.
The importance is in what the Set-aside delivers to the system as a whole.
Allowing every "hunter" access would be a bad idea.
Ask with cap in hand, as with any land, and accept a No when given....we all have been there.
You are actually "enjoying" your tax dollars by the earlier mentioned purpose and importance.
IF you can't understand that...oh, well.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Wed Aug 31, 2016 8:38 am

Mountaineer wrote:
Vision wrote:The only problem I have with CRP is farmers posting crp land when they are on the government dole. A small portion of my tax money that I pay every year goes into that farmers pocket yet I can't enjoy my tax dollars at work.
CRP's(and the rest) purpose and importance is not hunting....that is a simple and wonderful side benefit.
The importance is in what the Set-aside delivers to the system as a whole.
Allowing every "hunter" access would be a bad idea.
Ask with cap in hand, as with any land, and accept a No when given....we all have been there.
You are actually "enjoying" your tax dollars by the earlier mentioned purpose and importance.
IF you can't understand that...oh, well.

I have access to 1000's of acres in several states because I know how to ask and how to work on said farms, but that does not change my opinion. CRP purpose is to get farmers not to destroy sensitive lands and to not over produce thus needed another bail out, I get that. If I pay into the system and you take from the system then there should be reciprocal benefit to the payer IMO. Another example is ranchers that graze on public lands locking gates to public lands because they think it is their land. That's total BS but it happens all the time.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Wed Aug 31, 2016 6:37 pm

Vision wrote:CRP purpose is to get farmers not to destroy sensitive lands and to not over produce thus needed another bail out, I get that.....
Hardly...that view is as simplistic as it is narrow in assesing the true value of the set-aside programs...CRP and others.
You simply do not "get it".
You get only what supports how you want to think...such as equating BLM grazing to a set-aside program like CRP or CREP....which is silly and a stretch.
Set-asides are really not about hunting plusses or giving you a place to hunt.....your tax dollars are giving you a return in water quality and more.
IF....."your" reckons more than just yourself.

As before...oh, well.
Perhaps the angst is most a western thing and about more than one type of program......shame that more do not realize and appreciate the benefits of set-asides apart from what happens in their own neighborhood.
Neighborhoods....pretty small places all figgered.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by nikegundog » Wed Aug 31, 2016 7:51 pm

As long as I can remember the set aside programs have sold itself as a Soil erosion/Wildlife Habitat/Water Quality program. DU, Pheasants Forever, and every farm lobby I've seen has sold it as such, with the HEAVIEST emphasis on HABITAT. Pretty sure when I open next months issue of DU, they are going to be selling CRP as a Habitat program that has side benefits including water quality.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by ezzy333 » Wed Aug 31, 2016 8:58 pm

How many of you know how CRP is administered? Such as what are the requirements for eligibility, how the price is set, and other rules. I think it would give most of you a different perspective. Of course, all of the hunting related organizations are pushing it as well they should but they are just a by-product of the program.
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Thu Sep 01, 2016 5:05 am

nikegundog wrote:As long as I can remember the set aside programs have sold itself as a Soil erosion/Wildlife Habitat/Water Quality program. DU, Pheasants Forever, and every farm lobby I've seen has sold it as such, with the HEAVIEST emphasis on HABITAT. Pretty sure when I open next months issue of DU, they are going to be selling CRP as a Habitat program that has side benefits including water quality.

When DU or other critter/hunter organizations speak of set-aside programs, they are speaking toward a specific choir and increasing membership thru positive notes.
Which is fine and dandy but I would expect Habitat and what it delivers would indeed be first mention in their magazine.
Much the same as the ads in the magazine targeting a specific audience.
Emphasis matters little......what results matters more.
Sell what works at the time and place.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by nikegundog » Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:30 am

Mountaineer wrote:
nikegundog wrote:As long as I can remember the set aside programs have sold itself as a Soil erosion/Wildlife Habitat/Water Quality program. DU, Pheasants Forever, and every farm lobby I've seen has sold it as such, with the HEAVIEST emphasis on HABITAT. Pretty sure when I open next months issue of DU, they are going to be selling CRP as a Habitat program that has side benefits including water quality.

When DU or other critter/hunter organizations speak of set-aside programs, they are speaking toward a specific choir and increasing membership thru positive notes.
Which is fine and dandy but I would expect Habitat and what it delivers would indeed be first mention in their magazine.
Much the same as the ads in the magazine targeting a specific audience.
Emphasis matters little......what results matters more.
Sell what works at the time and place.
Well stated, they have always sold it to a variety of audiences, just pointing out it was never solely sold as a habitat program, a soil erosion program, a water quality program, or a commodities program. If one thinks it was ever solely a water quality program, they do so it supports what they want to believe.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:37 am

Win-win is nice and better is win-win-win-win-etc.

Again, how anything is sold is less important than that it is sold and what results spring from the sale.
Folks often do rate programs based upon themselves, I agree.

CREP and the Susquehana drainage tho would find water quality in the Bay predominate.
Still, people may disbelieve.....as they may not live downstream. :idea:

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:04 am

It can't be win-win-win-win if a portion of the participants aren't allowed to share in the benefits.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by ezzy333 » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:21 am

Vision wrote:It can't be win-win-win-win if a portion of the participants aren't allowed to share in the benefits.
Do you feel left out when you don't get to share meals with people on food stamps or sleeping in the homes of people who are getting rent assistance? Or maybe you would like your own cell in the prisons you are paying for. Problem is once you give the money to the government we have lost all claim to it as they claim ownership. That is exactly why many of us are asking for a government that allows us to spend our money where we want and not send it all to DC and have only a small percent ever returned to where we want it to go.
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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:41 am

ezzy333 wrote:
Vision wrote:It can't be win-win-win-win if a portion of the participants aren't allowed to share in the benefits.
Do you feel left out when you don't get to share meals with people on food stamps or sleeping in the homes of people who are getting rent assistance? Or maybe you would like your own cell in the prisons you are paying for. Problem is once you give the money to the government we have lost all claim to it as they claim ownership. That is exactly why many of us are asking for a government that allows us to spend our money where we want and not send it all to DC and have only a small percent ever returned to where we want it to go.

I feel exactly like you do regarding taxation. That's why it annoys me to see no trespassing signs on CRP fields.

Wouldn't it be great if we could check a box on our tax returns to appropriate our tax dollars according to our desires.


[ ] prisons
[ ] corporate tax breaks
[ ] farm subsidies
[x] none of the above
Last edited by Vision on Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:41 am

Vision wrote:It can't be win-win-win-win if a portion of the participants aren't allowed to share in the benefits.
Whoops :oops:, my bad as the younkers once said....I did not include enough "wins" for the You, the Tax-Paying Hunter.....that rank sits in comparative importance a good spell down the list.
You, The Tax Payer is, of course, a tad bit higher on the list......one must be willing to look at issues other than those including a front bead.
That does appears increasingly difficult to accomplish in these days.
Too bad that.
Too bad that ME is so popular.
Too bad that downstream is ....out of sight----out of mind.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:47 am

Mountaineer wrote:
Vision wrote:It can't be win-win-win-win if a portion of the participants aren't allowed to share in the benefits.
Whoops :oops:, my bad as the younkers once said....I did not include enough "wins" for the You, the Tax-Paying Hunter.....that rank sits in comparative importance a good spell down the list.
You, The Tax Payer is, of course, a tad bit higher on the list......one must be willing to look at issues other than those including a front bead.
That does appears increasingly difficult to accomplish in these days.
Too bad that.
Too bad that ME is so popular.
Too bad that downstream is ....out of sight----out of mind.

If the water quality and the other side benefits where so important then why the time limits on set aside programs?

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Mountaineer » Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:59 am

Vision wrote:If the water quality and the other side benefits where so important then why the time limits on set aside programs?
Several reasons...from Program design/legislative approval/etc. in a political world to some of those other Wins that appear to mean so little to you.

It would be nice to find perfection in political footballs but as with the unavoidable abuses of programs involving humans, that is just not reality.
I am simply happy to take the Wins as the come for as long as they come, for as long as the true positives are allowed to shine...independent of what ocassions me to uncase a scattergun.
Have a wonderful day at the mirror....Autumn is approaching.

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Re: CRP needs the support of hunters

Post by Vision » Thu Sep 01, 2016 3:39 pm

Mountaineer wrote:Have a wonderful day at the mirror....Autumn is approaching.
It is and thank you for wishing my day well.

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