Have you used / tested a e-collar on yourself ?

[Jon]

I just received my Innotek ET-400B training / Beeper collar today and tested all 4 stimulation levels on myself. (With new Batt.) My girlfriend had the fun of pushing the button. I went in another room so there was no indication when I would feel it to make the test as real as possible. ( yes, she loved it :roll: )

Just so you know I can feel a piece of dust land on my skin, so I'm not thick skinned like some people. I can handle pain, but don't like it any more than the next person.

#1 nothing, couldn't hardly feel it.

#2 very little tickle, almost a vibrate feeling.

#3 mild shock like putting a 9 volt batt. on your tongue. It doesn't hurt but you don't want to leave it there.

#4 shocked enough I wouldn't want to feel it for an extended period of time, but wasn't bad compared to a cattle prod or elec. fence.

My Girlfriend and her 12 yr. old son Michael tried it too and they both said the same thing. No big deal except for #4. Michael was in his room shocking himself, I didn't do it. I walked in as he was on #4 and said wow, that one shocked a little. Everybody wanted to try the new product so they knew what the dog would feel. Even though I'm the only one who will use it.

Based on this testing my opinion of e-collars has changed. I still won't zap my dog with #4 unless I need to for serious offenses. But 1 & 2 are no big deal with this model.

Just wanted to offer this info. to those like myself that didn't know how much stimulation the collar provided. It's really not as bad as you may think, unless your using the high stimulation setting.
I expected it to be worse like a cattle prod.

I know this may not be fair since all models were not compared but I'll leave that up to someone else.

[snips]

The Innotek collar is somewhat milder than the other collars, which I like for training the majority of dogs. There is an occasional dog I have to pull out the TT tho.

[kninebirddog]

HAve tested all the ones I intend to use
The DT has models with plenty of levels generally the number 1 do very little if at all then going up the scale 2 3 4 being mild and each level giving just a bit more stimulation 5 6 7 being the next levels but still with in tolerance not extreme 8 9 10 seems like every three on them go up a real notch way better then their older models
The tri tronics level 1 is about a level 3 on my DT 2 = about a 6 on my DT
and yes the Higher levels can catch your attention

These collars just get better and better

Edited 1/2/2008 after much issue with DT and Sportdog and Thankfully I had my Tro Tronics Classic 70 as my go to collar when the other fell short on performance


I have gone back over a year ago to Tri Tronics The levels are lower for the low end
I ahve 3 the G3 which is their answer to be in the market against sportdog the levels are very low and the reliablilty of the collar has impressed me have had it about a year now

I also have the Pro 100 which i use for training again level 1 low I ahve yet to find a dog that will respond to it 1 high being extremely mild and a dog will do well in basic yard work with level 2 being very fine for field work
then the Classic 70 at is and has been my go to collar for guiding and hunting the new G2 has done great with how the stimulation levels comes across


So Juts gotta love the technogolgy of today and am Proud to say I am back with tri tronics have given the others a chance..I can say all compnaies have great customer service only problem with a few of them I found myself talking to customer service to much and customer service generally one doesn't call them to have idle conversation

and TT i had one issue with an older collar which was taken care of over the phone and the other times I called to order batteries for some older collars for clients and one of mine which was over 7 years old

So Better customer service for me is the ones where I don't have to call in the first place

[grant]

I've done it with my dogtra. I made lindsay do it also. She didn't like it, but I enjoyed seeing her squirm! On occasion, I'll threaten her with it.... Great motivational tool... I guess....

[HUTCH]

I tested my sport dog collar and it wasnt that bad at all. I could see someone definatley hurting a dog more with a choke chain.

[12 Volt Man]

I have done it with my Dogra. Just on my fingers. I made up my mind that I won't shock a dog more that I would like. So I tested how far I can take it. If I take the setting up past 60 on the dogra dial, I don't like it.
Cooper does great at a setting of 40 on my collar. Cowboy needs it at 60.

[Birdhunter1]

Yes I test the collars on myself everytime before they go on the dog with at least two different levels. I had one stuck on the high level once and everytime I hit the low level the dog would yelp, jump amd come running to me.
I had one dog that i could zap with the lowest leel and it would get her attention, another dog I have you can zap it on high and it won't notice it sometimes. And then on Rocket he knows when the zap is coming, amazing how they can be trained to your tone of voice and he knows which tone is the last straw before he gets zapped!

Grant, how well do thoese shock collars work on wives? I've threatened my fiance with them before and she shows me her fist whenever I mention it. I todl her theother day she was worse than a hard headed dog, cause I could use a shock collar on the dog and get it to listen!

[kninebirddog]

I Tested mine on the upper inner part of my arm above the elbow..then on my forearm big difference in sensations

[gone]

I am surprised that the poll isn't 100% yes. I don't know anyonethat has a collar that hasn't tried it on themselves. I have the TT Classic 70 & have tried it on myself & various other relatives. I won't go past a three (yeah I'm a wuss) unless my dog is in danger I won't go above that with them.

[Maurice]

I test my collars everyday on myself to make sure they are working right. Tritronics will get a tough dog attention if you use it at the highest level. Dogtra will stop a government mule in it's tracks set at the highest level.. It is very very rare for me to use the ecollar above mid range even for tough stuff.

Mo

[Jon]

I test my collars everyday on myself to make sure they are working right.

Tritronics will get a tough dog attention if you use it at the highest level. Dogtra will stop a government mule in it's tracks set at the highest level..
Mo

The Innotek collar I just got has a light bulb tester. The low setting shows a very low flicker and working up to high shows a brighter light. I can use this to test the unit but I wanted to feel the levels for myself. ( I used the inside of my arm. As the dog wears the collar and the skin becomes conditioned in that area the dog prob. won't feel as much stimulation as I did )

I'm glad to hear about other collars, the stimulation levels being much diff. is info. that will help others when looking for a new collar.

When someone before mentioned the T/T collar set on #1 feels like a #6 on other collars this must be a older unit and may be where the term shock collar came from. If T/T lowest setting feels like my #3 or #4 and goes up from there, I wouldn't have the same opinion on e-collar use as I do with the innotek I just got. There needs to be a setting so low you can hardly feel it and go up from there in my opinion. This would also help change the negative outlook some people have about e-collars.

I would love to see a voltage test done on diff. models set at #1 and working up for comparison.

[gone]

On my TT Classic 70 the lowest setting is barely noticeable, I haven't felt the lowest setting on others, but if they are weaker than my #1 then I don't see a point to even having a setting that low unless you have a very small dog that has thin hair. My EP/GSP mix has very thin hair & weighs 40 lbs or so (2 years old) & he barely feels a #1. Just my $.02

[TAK]

I test my collars everyday on myself to make sure they are working right. Tritronics will get a tough dog attention if you use it at the highest level. Dogtra will stop a government mule in it's tracks set at the highest level.. It is very very rare for me to use the ecollar above mid range even for tough stuff.

Mo

Mo, "Dogtra will stop a government mule in it's tracks set at the highest level.." You telling me I have a mule in the kennel! I have a little bitch that I really think she enjoys the 100 setting! I have even seen her stop and scratch at the collar as if she had an itch! Thats with a Dogtra 2000! True she would chew her own leg of it slowed her down!

[Weege3]

i cant feel anything with my innotek even on the highest level but my brother didn't like it when i hit him with it

[rkalgren]

I decided when I got my Dogtra that I wouldn't use it on a dog if I didn't try it on myself first. I took it up until it was on the verge of being pain instead of just annoying. That is the level I won't go above for a dog unless it is in danger.

[Sylvia]

I do not have an E-Collar, so didn't try either

[gwgdog66]

I always knick my hand with the collar before I put it on my dogs.

[Dave Quindt]

I decided when I got my Dogtra that I wouldn't use it on a dog if I didn't try it on myself first. I took it up until it was on the verge of being pain instead of just annoying. That is the level I won't go above for a dog unless it is in danger.

Bob,

While your approach is certainly understandable, it conflicts with the science behind both human and canine anatomy.

Human skin has pores that allow for the release of mosture, as sweat. That mosture sits in the flesh just under the skin. Dogs do not. That moisture helps conduct the electricity in humans, which it doesn't do in dogs. Additionally, dogs have fur covering the skin where humans do not.

As a result, the way a human feels a correction is very different than the way a dog feels a correction.

IMO, the best thing for the dog is a correction at the level that persuades the dog not to repeat the behavior while at the same time not impacting the dog's overall demeanor. Whether that correction level is under or over your personal tolerance is irrelevant to the dog.

JMO,
Dave

[Ayres]

Dave, your answer to Bob makes a lot of sense, though I've actually got the same philosophy as Bob, as I've never taken the e-collar to the dog above the stimulation level that I've experienced personally. However, I've nicked myself pretty hard with it (near max levels) and have never had to go half that high on my dog to achieve the desired result, so the point seems somewhat moot.

But, as an amateur trainer, I like to know what I'm having the dog experience. It also solves a lot of problems when someone complains that e-collars are inhumane. They ask "how would you like to get shocked with that thing," and I respond, "I have... and a lot higher than what it takes for a correction on the dog." That usually stops the complaints. If the complaints persist, I'd probably offer to let the person complaining experience the nick themselves. That's never happened though.

So I guess while the anatomy of a human and a canine are different, I'd still advocate for a trainer to actually experience an e-collar nick before using the collar on a dog. I believe that would have an effect to reduce overall e-collar abuse. Just speculation, though. It would be interesting to see a study done on this topic.

[Dave Quindt]

Steven,

"I like to know what I'm having the dog experience" is a pretty scary precedent. Why stop with the e-collar? What about tail docking, dew claw removal or force fetch? What about neutering?

You don't know what the dog is going to experience because you are physically and mentally different. A human doesn't "need" to experience an e-collar correction because they have the mental capacity to understand how an e-collar works.

Dogs are not humans and humans are not dogs. We spend far too much time and energy treating dogs like humans when in the end, this does more harm than good.

So many amateurs want to use pressure as a "last resort" and then use the slightest amount of pressure that they are personally "comfortable" with regardless of whether it is in the best interest of the dog or not. As a result many amateur-trained dogs are actually subjected to a long, drawn out torture of sorts. They are allowed to get away with murder and then when the training finally starts, pressure is applied so softly and inconsistently to have little effective impact.

Spending time with the pros that I have, I've seen hundreds of amateur-trained dogs that are a wreck because their owners are afraid to make logical corrections at appropriate levels (to the dog, not to the owner's conscience). In the end, "corrections" are made as a result of frustration, if at all. The escalation of pressure is slow and drawn out, as the owner's conscience grows to tolerate more intense pressure.

It's just like science class in high school; the frog in the pan of increasingly hotter water never realizes that he's being cooked. The result is a dog that requires either a huge amount of pressure to get anything accomplished or is relegated to the couch because he's so confused about what he's being asked to do.

Want to reduce the amount of e-collar abuse? Start by "requiring" (don't know how this could be accomplished) that first time hunting dog owners have their first dog trained by a knowledgeable pro. The owner would be present through the training of his dog, and other dogs to see and understand the use of pressure as a training tool. IMO most amateurs don't have a good idea of what it takes to train hunting dogs to a finished level; both in time and in technique.

FWIW,
Dave

[ezzy333]

Good post Dave. I don't think there is any corralation at all between what we feel and what a dog feels. But it makes us feel good when we try to make a dog human. It always bothers me when you see the owner refer to themselves as the dogs Mom or the dogs as their girls or boys.

My dogs are dogs and not human and are treated as such. That seems to work for both of us and the dogs are very appreciative of the place they have in our household.

When you look at what animals do in the wild you get the idea that they are much less senative to pain than we are and probably don't have the same reaction to stimuli that we do.

Ezzy

[Ayres]

"I like to know what I'm having the dog experience" is a pretty scary precedent. Why stop with the e-collar? What about tail docking, dew claw removal or force fetch? What about neutering?

Fair enough, fair enough. In each of those, though, you're talking about an application of force directly from the hand or a medical procedure (if even a quasi-medical procedure as anesthetic is rarely used in dew claw removal and tail docking). Apples and oranges when comparing to a remote, electronic stimulus, IMO.

You don't know what the dog is going to experience because you are physically and mentally different. A human doesn't "need" to experience an e-collar correction because they have the mental capacity to understand how an e-collar works.

Well that's where I disagree. I don't think every person has the inherent knowledge of how e-collars work, what the stimulus levels are like, etc. That's why there are both e-collar abusers and e-collar abhorers among those of us that use the training tools properly.

Dogs are not humans and humans are not dogs. We spend far too much time and energy treating dogs like humans when in the end, this does more harm than good.

While I don't disagree, I must point out that I never advocated treating dogs like humans. (This goes to all of Ezzy's post too.)

So many amateurs want to use pressure as a "last resort" and then use the slightest amount of pressure that they are personally "comfortable" with regardless of whether it is in the best interest of the dog or not.

I learned how to use the e-collar from a pro. The method was validated by another pro within the video "Perfect Start." That method is to use only the amount of stimulus as required to actually correct the dog. For my dog, that's setting #36 on my Dogtra 1700 NCP. On the rare occasion that #36 fails to achieve the desired result, I crank up the rheostat dial until the stimulus works as intended (highest I've gotten is #45). Again, this is the method of e-collar correction as advocated by the pro that I've worked with and the pros that produced "Perfect Start". I think you may have misunderstood what I was posting or took liberty with what I posted to make a point. I do not agree that the method I and many others use is a "last resort" or "using the slightest amount of pressure that they are 'comfortable' with."

As a result many amateur-trained dogs are actually subjected to a long, drawn out torture of sorts. They are allowed to get away with murder and then when the training finally starts, pressure is applied so softly and inconsistently to have little effective impact.

Spending time with the pros that I have, I've seen hundreds of amateur-trained dogs that are a wreck because their owners are afraid to make logical corrections at appropriate levels (to the dog, not to the owner's conscience). In the end, "corrections" are made as a result of frustration, if at all. The escalation of pressure is slow and drawn out, as the owner's conscience grows to tolerate more intense pressure.

Again, I think you have taken liberty with what I posted to make a point. I don't necessarily disagree with your statements, and I certainly didn't advocate the opposite position.

Want to reduce the amount of e-collar abuse? Start by "requiring" (don't know how this could be accomplished) that first time hunting dog owners have their first dog trained by a knowledgeable pro. The owner would be present through the training of his dog, and other dogs to see and understand the use of pressure as a training tool. IMO most amateurs don't have a good idea of what it takes to train hunting dogs to a finished level; both in time and in technique.

I'd absolutely agree with that assertion as well. It's not an ideal world, though, so we both know it ain't gonna happen. What might happen, though, is for someone to take the time to feel the nick of an e-collar before strapping it on their dog and blasting away. It's rare that there's ever only one solution to a problem. I don't believe that this is one of those instances, either. And it certainly couldn't hurt. Well, maybe just for a tenth of a second or so.

[Ayres]

... I don't think there is any corralation at all between what we feel and what a dog feels. ... When you look at what animals do in the wild you get the idea that they are much less senative to pain than we are and probably don't have the same reaction to stimuli that we do.

Do wild animals correlate to domestic animals? How do we pick and choose what experiences are "similar" without quantifiable data?

It seems pretty easy to say that dogs aren't human, and that the experience would be different. (I agreed with Dave's original point on this as well). However, I'd also say that domestic dogs aren't wild dogs. There are too many things that wild animals go though that domesticated animals don't. That's just my opinion on the matter, though. YMMV

[garytglenn]

Yes and it hurt!

[kninebirddog]

When properly done the stimulation froman e collar will cause the musle to spasm ....
If the stimulation hurts it is too high or worsewhich is cause by collar not being properly put on and too loose is a poor contact which can be to light contact where the value actually arcs from a brief touch and thus becomes a shock instead of a stimulation

When testing a collar put in on the inside of your arm above your elbow besure to have the contact points making a firm contact

I have shown people the diffeernce ..watch when their dogs would yelp with their old collar and then put the Tri tronic on the same dog and their dog stop yelping and start responding positively to the stimualtion

[Vizsla Vince]

Yes, I have, & My teenage son, my nephew & my son's friend were "experimenting" with the collar Christmas Eve... The results were pretty amusing to watch!! It wasn't until they were half way through the scale when I introduced them to "Nick"!

[Trekmoor]

I first saw an e- collar used about 40 years ago. It had only one level of shock and it was fierce! The modern ones are so much better, I've just bought one 'cos I can't run down dogs any more. I have used it on myself and feel nothing until level 4 out of 12 levels, I tried it on the soft skin on the inside of my wrist. I have now began to use it on my 12 month old pup and he will respond at level 3 or sometimes 4 depending on the situation. He does not appear to feel anything at the lower levels, I can't help wondering why there is a level 1.

Bill

---"One toot and yer oot !!!"---

[GSPoindexter]

I plan on testing mine out when I buy it.

[Greg Jennings]

I have used it on myself and feel nothing until level 4 out of 12 levels, I tried it on the soft skin on the inside of my wrist. I have now began to use it on my 12 month old pup and he will respond at level 3 or sometimes 4 depending on the situation. He does not appear to feel anything at the lower levels, I can't help wondering why there is a level 1.

Collars vary. I test my collar before I put it on the dog, but I wouldn't take myself up to a 4-medium lest I wet myself.

Greg J.

[Millerdog]

tri tronics classic 70
1. tickle
2. 9volt on tounge
3. dont want that there for long
didnt go higher. usually dont unless my dog is chasing a deer and I want her to stop.

[BigShooter]

Our CEO volunteered to let me test it on him before using it on my dog.

So that's when he first starting having that head twitch!

Seriously the first collar I ever tested was TTs "Boss" I believe it was called. One of the higher setting pins was inserted. I dropped it like a hot potato. With my current TT Upland the second or third level from the lowest is sufficient.

[bobspheasant]

M wife, an obedience dog trainer, suggested I try it on myself before trying it on the dog. We use dogtra and I tried it on level 40 or so, first on nick (not bad) and then on continuous (eeeouch!). I rarely use the collar on the dog though, just a little nick from time to time.

[BoJack]

Definately.I want to know what the dog's feeling.I test it on myself every time before I put it on the dog.

[lightonthebay]

I wouldn't test one on myself! But I did hold an ex-girfriend down and tested it on her. Apparently it worked well!

[mtjim]

I wouldn't test one on myself! But I did hold an ex-girfriend down and tested it on her. Apparently it worked well!

Actually my grandson volunteered!

[WolfMansDad]

I tested shock, pager, and beeper on myself. One thing that surprised me was, with the collar around my neck, the beeper doesn't really sound all that loud. The speaker points away from the dog's head and so doesn't deafen him when you hit the button. Turn it around and point the speaker at yourself, or stand right next to the dog wearing it, and it's ear splitting.

[lamoka]

I tried My G3 but only after my wife did, I hate shocks worse then bee stings. Ever since I took a jolt off my cars distributer when i was setting the timing I cant stand being shocked even static shocks get me. I was suprised at how mild the stimulation was I did it up to 2 and it was not bad at all I currently have mine set at 1.5 and have great results with my Eng. Pointer. And no I realy dont want to go past 2 but I will before I apply it to my dog or maybe I can convince the wife to try it.

[Ditch__Parrot]

I can't believe that 11% haven't. Testing it on myself was one of the first things I did when I first got one. Then when I got a new one with alot more options for stimuli I did it again testing out all the different settings on myself.

[Neil]

Testing on yourself does not really let you know what the dog is feeling, dogs are much (on average) more sensitive to electricity than humans, horses even more so.

There is such a wide variation in how different people and animals respond that you just can't tell in advance. That is why it is important to train with the lowest level that will give you the results.

If people would just remember that dogs aren't little people,

Neil

[birddogger]

Testing on yourself does not really let you know what the dog is feeling, dogs are much (on average) more sensitive to electricity than humans, horses even more so.

There is such a wide variation in how different people and animals respond that you just can't tell in advance. That is why it is important to train with the lowest level that will give you the results.

If people would just remember that dogs aren't little people,

Neil

This is exactly right!! I have tried mine on myself, but only to see how much difference there was between one setting to the next. I didn't get very far.

Charlie

[birddog1968]

i have not tested it on myself.....whats the point?

Its the dog thats gotta respond not me.....One pointer takes no more than 25 and the other stays at 20 or less.
This is with a dogtra 500.

[gittrdonebritts]

tried out the sport dog collars i had and now my TT collars on me, low levels are fine but, i always feel like taking the collar off the dogs i see getting enough juice pumped through them to jump start my truck and put it on the owner and see how they like, squealing with pain and terror

[HuntinSconny]

I bought my tri tronics collar off of craigs list last year so I decided to try it out as I was driving away. Not knowing the settings or paying more attention to the road, I had it turned all the way up to 10. I "bleep" near went off the road, my whole arm spasmed from it!
Needless to say, I have never turned the collar up past 2 when I have it on the dog.

[shooter2005]

cant say ive ever had that urge to shock myself with a collar... im an aviation electrician... i get shocked enough. only volunteered to get shocked once and that was with a taser for training purposes.

[kninebirddog]

cant say ive ever had that urge to shock myself with a collar... im an aviation electrician... i get shocked enough. only volunteered to get shocked once and that was with a taser for training purposes.

AN E collar specially the E collars of today shouldn't be about Shocking the dog

[birddog1968]

cant say ive ever had that urge to shock myself with a collar... im an aviation electrician... i get shocked enough. only volunteered to get shocked once and that was with a taser for training purposes.

AN E collar specially the E collars of today shouldn't be about Shocking the dog

Electricians will speak about electrical stimulation in plain terms K9, it is what it is. We are also not too keen on feeling the juice as we've been there done that

Stim'ing yourself really doesnt tell you much, the response and susceptibility to a "stim" depends on alot of factors just in humans....dryness of the skin, mental state and physical state. I can only imagine its the same for a dog, might be that an oily coat also makes for better contact.

But hey if ya wanna test it on yourself have at it......

[drake handler]

Yes I have. I coulden't tell if it was working on my fingers so I put it on my neck. It didn't feel good.

[crewzm]

Has any one tested a Dogtra on themselves using level 120? The 5-15 range works for most corrections on my dog? Just wondering what level 120 felt like.

[silentk]

yep.... like an idiot i strapped it on my neck while working in the garden...my dad was visiting at the time so i gave him the kontrol so it would hit me when i wouldn't know it was koming....

[mcclinj]

Knine,

I have the Pro 200 model, and my little GSP will respond about 80% of the time on a 1-low. When I took it out of the box and started "testing" it on myself, I didn't realize both contacts had to make contact. I only had one finger on one side of the collar feeling nothing on levels 1-5. I must have made contact with the other point at the same time....Imagine my surprise when I found out how well it worked at a level 6 high...lol

-John