Teaching come by yourself

[DogNewbie]

Hey All,

I've been having some difficulty training my pup to come by myself. The main problem is that if its just the two of us in the yard he wants to be right next to me so the only opportunity I get to instill the command come into his head is when I walk out the back door and he's across the yard but by the that time he's already well on his way to greet me. Again he's only 3mons so maybe that's sufficient training at that age? Our training sessions are still very short so maybe I should just focus on whoa and hopefully that will help down the road when teaching come? Thanks for the advise,

Tim

[birddog1968]

wouldn't worry about whoa, take the dog on some challenging walks (for a young pup) and let him build confidence and some independence.

[Sharon]

Hey All,

I've been having some difficulty training my pup to come by myself. The main problem is that if its just the two of us in the yard he wants to be right next to me so the only opportunity I get to instill the command come into his head is when I walk out the back door and he's across the yard but by the that time he's already well on his way to greet me. Again he's only 3mons so maybe that's sufficient training at that age? Our training sessions are still very short so maybe I should just focus on whoa and hopefully that will help down the road when teaching come? Thanks for the advise,

Tim

That's what pups do. Their independence isn't great so they hang around you. Don't worry there will be MANY times when you can teach come.

[GUNDOGS]

you can take pup into a field on a long check cord about 50 ft..if you are in a more open area (not back yard) they tend to wonder away to investigate so pup will start to become independent and wonder away from you..if you have any friends with a dog or pup and go along with you it will also get your pup to get out from under you feet..if you want to have pup come to you just go over and pick up the check cord say COME and reel pup into you..praise pup when it comes to you and let go of the check cord again..in no time pup will want to come to you for some praise and in no time associate COME with coming to you for some praise..one thing is make sure you dont overdue COME or you will get a pup that is afraid to wonder on its own...good luck, ruth

[RayGubernat]

With a puppy, the absolute BEST time to overlay a command is when it is doing exactly what you want. When your pup is barrelling toward you, give the command, over and over. Kneel down and open your arms, encourage the dog to come right in to you. When it does...love him up and praise him. It will help to ingrain it in the dog's mind and it will WANT to come to you with its head up and happy. Some call it "play training."

Larry Mueller wrote a book about this type of stuff called: "Speed train your bird dog." Essentially he pointed out opportunities to train when doing everyday, routine tasks. The beauty of this is that you will be doing these tasks, every day somketimes multiple times per day and therefore will be training or play training every single time.

Repetition, encouragement, repetition.

Have fun.

RayG

[Sharon]

Well said Ray. Same philosophy works for an 8 week old puppy. Say "Come. Come. Come ." when pup is coming towards you on his/her own.

[4dabirds]

With a puppy, the absolute BEST time to overlay a command is when it is doing exactly what you want. When your pup is barrelling toward you, give the command, over and over. Kneel down and open your arms, encourage the dog to come right in to you. When it does...love him up and praise him. It will help to ingrain it in the dog's mind and it will WANT to come to you with its head up and happy. Some call it "play training."

Larry Mueller wrote a book about this type of stuff called: "Speed train your bird dog." Essentially he pointed out opportunities to train when doing everyday, routine tasks. The beauty of this is that you will be doing these tasks, every day somketimes multiple times per day and therefore will be training or play training every single time.

Repetition, encouragement, repetition.

Have fun.

RayG

When training with a clicker this is basically the same method although it is a little more pro-active. The dog will learn to offer the behavior that is rewardable.

[ultracarry]

Two tips.

1. Don't teach the dog to come.. teach it Here.

2. Use a hallway and close the doors.

Easy

[GUNDOGS]

Two tips.

1. Don't teach the dog to come.. teach it Here.

2. Use a hallway and close the doors.

Easy

we teach both, COME to come right to us and HERE to come closer and change direction but not all the way to us....ruth

[4dabirds]

[quote="ultracarry"]Two tips.

1. Don't teach the dog to come.. teach here
why?

[birddog1968]

yea i second that .....WHY?


Is that important to do even if you use spanish or german commands.....

[birddog1968]

LOL, I never use the dogs name except to call them in.....the dog never gets in trouble when I use his/her name. BELLE (insert dogs name), means come in and get loved up.....always served me well never using the dogs name in anger or frustration.

[DogNewbie]

With a puppy, the absolute BEST time to overlay a command is when it is doing exactly what you want. When your pup is barrelling toward you, give the command, over and over. Kneel down and open your arms, encourage the dog to come right in to you. When it does...love him up and praise him. It will help to ingrain it in the dog's mind and it will WANT to come to you with its head up and happy. Some call it "play training."

Larry Mueller wrote a book about this type of stuff called: "Speed train your bird dog." Essentially he pointed out opportunities to train when doing everyday, routine tasks. The beauty of this is that you will be doing these tasks, every day somketimes multiple times per day and therefore will be training or play training every single time.

Repetition, encouragement, repetition.

Have fun.

RayG

I've heard that if you repeat a command over and over the dog will eventually not associate the command with the word? Or is that only when the dog isn't complying?

[DogNewbie]

So this morning I modified an exercise that someone had posted on the ecollar conditioning thread. I took my 30ft cc and simply wrapped it around the smooth metal bar of my chain link fence making it impossible for the pup to come to me (the fence is keeping him from being able to simply walk around the pole. Then I simply walked 20ft away and said come and dropped the cord as he bolted to me! It worked great. Only did that 3 - 4 times, but I can see how this method could quickly get him to understand the command. Getting come instilled in his head will also help calm my worries about having him out on the grouse trails this fall.

[Thinking]

I use treats for teaching come. I find the one thing that my dog will do backflips for, and use it ONLY for recall. Initially he gets them every time, then slowly they get cut back, but I never cut them out 100%. I find it helps a lot.

[RayGubernat]

I've heard that if you repeat a command over and over the dog will eventually not associate the command with the word? Or is that only when the dog isn't complying?

Repeating the command when the dog is not complying is, in fact, teaching it to ignore the command. Repeating the command when the dog is performing the task is reinforcing and if done with the right tone, is also encouraging.

Your dog is a puppy. They have the attention span of a gnat. Play interespersed with training is one of the better things you can do. The best way I have found to build compliance in a puppy is to encourage it, be happy and give praise when it is doing what you want and ignore it and be stern and disapproving when it does not.

RayG

[gittrdonebritts]

Teaching the pup to Whoa on command at this age may seem a little silly but you can do other things to help with steadiness down the road make him stand and wait for his food make him stand and wait to go inside when your out walking every now and then stop and have him stand and wait next to you, move out to the side a bit or behind him and make him stand still don't put a command to it yet but make sure you release him before he goes a head, this will all help later on when steadying him on birds, and I mean much later he is 3 months right ? he has got a lot of learning and exploring to do till your ready to steady him on birds and use a whoa command if you so chose to.

[DogNewbie]

Teaching the pup to Whoa on command at this age may seem a little silly but you can do other things to help with steadiness down the road make him stand and wait for his food make him stand and wait to go inside when your out walking every now and then stop and have him stand and wait next to you, move out to the side a bit or behind him and make him stand still don't put a command to it yet but make sure you release him before he goes a head, this will all help later on when steadying him on birds, and I mean much later he is 3 months right ? he has got a lot of learning and exploring to do till your ready to steady him on birds and use a whoa command if you so chose to.

Correct. 3.5 mons. I have been doing exactly that so far. Mostly with a hand signal but if he's complying really well I have started saying whoa. But I'm keeping these sessions EXTREMELY short, and I always release him. He already knows he's not eating until I say so.

[tabcha63]

Im in the same boat, new to dog training and doing it by myself.

What i did was use an Eyebolt and hammered it into my clothes line post (wife didnt mind ). Ran a 30' check cord thru it, put on my dogs harness (only use a harness of some type for this method), and stood 15' away from the post. Only use a harness not a collar. When you pull him back to the post it will choke him. You could also use a tree for this method.

I would pull on the cord until the dog was up against the post and repeat come over and over as he came to me. When he got there i praised the heck out of him. Pull the cord until the dog was drug back to the post, rinse and repeat. After a while i overlaid the ecollar and whistle.

He could be 100 yards away from me, I blow the whistle he comes.

Also, my pup is a year old and collar conditioned. Since your pup is 3 months you may want to wait a few months to start, but then again since youre not using an ecollar i dont see the harm in a few minutes of reps using this method. Its an easy show-pups drill.

[DogNewbie]

After a while i overlaid the ecollar and whistle.

He could be 100 yards away from me, I blow the whistle he comes.

Yeah, I'd like to eventually add a whistle, but I live in a city and yard training takes place in my little backyard...not sure the neighbors would be too keen on me blowing a whistle all the time. haha.

Tim

[DogNewbie]

After a while i overlaid the ecollar and whistle.

He could be 100 yards away from me, I blow the whistle he comes.

Yeah, I'd like to eventually add a whistle, but I live in a city and yard training takes place in my little backyard...not sure the neighbors would be too keen on me blowing a whistle all the time. haha.

Tim

I was also thinking of using the whistle for quartering once it's time to start that training down the road..save my vocal cords.
What methods do you use to teach that?

Tim

[birddog1968]

why not take the dog afield to teach come......if you have to use an eyebolt to get him to leave you I would say the dog needs more time in the field building independence and confidence.....Just my take.

[tabcha63]

I havent started quarter training with the whistle yet, only whoa and come. Like i said my pup is a year old next week (NAVHDA NA testing next weekend ) so i havent really started "training" him yet.

Since your pup is still pretty young, i would reccomend getting Tom Dokkens Retriever Training (yes I know, I own a GSP ). I really like the photos along with the explanation. A good portion of the book is obediance training. I was having trouble training my dog to sit when i commanded and also had trouble reinforcing it with the ecollar. Read the book, with in a week he was sitting when i commanded and responded to the ecollar. He also now sits when i stop with him at heel. All of that happend in about a week or two. I didnt pick up the book until my pup was about 8.5 months old, but he is still a pup yet and working on solidifying OB.

[tabcha63]

why not take the dog afield to teach come......if you have to use an eyebolt to get him to leave you I would say the dog needs more time in the field building independence and confidence.....Just my take.

Its not so much that I need him to leave, its a matter of convenience. I can go thru way more reps with the eyebolt in 5 minutes than i can walking out to the field, letting him run away, call back, and walk back out of the field. By all means, this does not mean that I dont do it in the field, its just another part of training. This also helps if you dont have a field adjacent to your property to train in (i.e. city, town, etc...).

Training is a matter of taking advantage of what you have available. As DogNewbie mentioned, he lives in a populated area so field work every day (or every other) may not be an option. As much as we would all like to own 20+ acres of prime hunting land, we deal with what we have. Im just fortunate enough to live beside a farmer that lets me catch pigeons in his barn and train in his fields.

[birddog1968]

I understand , and not condemning anyone for where they live. My only point is the OP stated his dog wont leave his side.....if that was the case with my dog i wouldn't be worried about come as much as getting him to go.

A dog with a love of fields and woods will go, and thus give you a chance to teach come. To me building the desire to go is paramount, as a dog glued to you is no fun to try and hunt with.

[tabcha63]

So this morning I modified an exercise that someone had posted on the ecollar conditioning thread. I took my 30ft cc and simply wrapped it around the smooth metal bar of my chain link fence making it impossible for the pup to come to me (the fence is keeping him from being able to simply walk around the pole. Then I simply walked 20ft away and said come and dropped the cord as he bolted to me! It worked great. Only did that 3 - 4 times, but I can see how this method could quickly get him to understand the command. Getting come instilled in his head will also help calm my worries about having him out on the grouse trails this fall.

Ah, i must have missed this post. This is a modified version of my eyebolt. Id stay about 15' (half of the checkcord) away from the fence so you can pull him back to the fence and dont have to keep wrapping it around the post. When he gets to you, the end of the cord should be in your hand. You do this for about a week, he'll understand Come in no time. Now you just have to wait until hes old enough to ecollar condition until you can sink it in his head that Come means Come, no matter what. Not stop and sniff the deer poop along the way (some times taste [gross dogs :roll: ]), to me now!

[Sharon]

LOL, I never use the dogs name except to call them in.....the dog never gets in trouble when I use his/her name. BELLE (insert dogs name), means come in and get loved up.....always served me well never using the dogs name in anger or frustration.

Now that's a good idea.

[DogNewbie]

I understand , and not condemning anyone for where they live. My only point is the OP stated his dog wont leave his side.....if that was the case with my dog i wouldn't be worried about come as much as getting him to go.

A dog with a love of fields and woods will go, and thus give you a chance to teach come. To me building the desire to go is paramount, as a dog glued to you is no fun to try and hunt with.

So far I believe he's shown a lot of confidence in the field for a young pup. He'll range 50+ yards out, which I would consider pretty good for a 3.5mo old pup (although I don't have any experience so..) He also has no problem exploring out of eyesight. The reason I can't get him from my side at home is because I usually train after work and he's been by himself for most the day...he's just happy to be hanging out! He is very independent on the weekends after we've spent a full day together, but I'm trying to train a little everyday.

[birddog1968]

I see, well thats a good thing. The only way Ive ever taught come is with a check cord and the command then reel the dog in, i believe this works even better when the dog is not wanting to come in....besides having him understand the command , in the yard when he wants to come I don't think teaches as much as when he doesn't want to come in. I Always love them up when they do come in. I try to use a collar for as little as possible but will use it as last resort.

I relate that to Force fetch when sometimes the dog is doing well cause he wants to....sometimes you have to engineer in a chance for correction to proof what is going on....I like a sharp snap of the check cord, its almost as electric of a reaction as an e collar, especially if you time it just as they turn to go away, then reel them in. real attention getter.

[DogNewbie]

The only way Ive ever taught come is with a check cord and the command then reel the dog in.

haha, well, I tried this but he decided it was actually fun to be dragged through the grass on his back...It's really my own fault for continuing to drag him through the grass when it first started, but it was so freaking funny I couldn't help myself....well that backfired! haha

[tabcha63]

Sounds like youre in the same situation as me. Trigger ranges around 50 yards in the field and generally stays in site, but when i tried the let the dog wonder away in teh yard it didnt work too well. When i tried to train after work he did the same thing, he was just so excited to be be outside with me he wanted to play and wouldnt leave my side. Thats where the eyebolt came in, it was a methodical way to train in the yard after work without going into the field. I did it for about two weeks, more less just to show him the command come. Now i pretty much just do it in the field.

[birddog1968]

Sounds like he discovered an escape that worked....dogs will manufacture all kinds of escape behaviors its your job to not allow it to work.

Good luck with your pup.

[tabcha63]

The only way Ive ever taught come is with a check cord and the command then reel the dog in.

haha, well, I tried this but he decided it was actually fun to be dragged through the grass on his back...It's really my own fault for continuing to drag him through the grass when it first started, but it was so freaking funny I couldn't help myself....well that backfired! haha

This is where the check cord around the post will work for you.

Put the cord around the post standing half the length of the cord away. Drag him back to the post holding him there, give the come command releasing him so he can run towards you.

Positive: He runs towards you when you command come.

Negative: Getting drug away from you back to the post, making him want to run toward you that much more.

Thats why i like this approach so much, when Trigger gets pulled back to the post he jumps around trying to get back to me. When he calms down and stands there I give the Come command and he bolts right to me.

[birddog1968]

I would have jerked the dog up on his feet and sent him on, not allowing him to lay down and act a fool. Once he's out front again give him a Come/here and reel him in again. Give him no joy with the aviodence behavior.

[DogNewbie]

I would have jerked the dog up on his feet and sent him on, not allowing him to lay down and act a fool. Once he's out front again give him a Come/here and reel him in again. Give him no joy with the aviodence behavior.

Yeah that would have been smart. I'll try that out next time. Thanks for the advise!

Tim

[GUNDOGS]

I see, well thats a good thing. The only way Ive ever taught come is with a check cord and the command then reel the dog in, i believe this works even better when the dog is not wanting to come in....besides having him understand the command , in the yard when he wants to come I don't think teaches as much as when he doesn't want to come in. I Always love them up when they do come in. I try to use a collar for as little as possible but will use it as last resort.

I relate that to Force fetch when sometimes the dog is doing well cause he wants to....sometimes you have to engineer in a chance for correction to proof what is going on....I like a sharp snap of the check cord, its almost as electric of a reaction as an e collar, especially if you time it just as they turn to go away, then reel them in. real attention getter.

+1 ...ruth