A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
- nikegundog
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A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Did a little looking for a well bred Pointing Lab today and came to the conclusion their is no such a dog. The Labrador Retriever has been the most popular bred dog according to the AKC for about the last 50 years, so you would think their would be at least 20 well bred pointing lab breeders out there but I can't find one. So I am now in the camp of, a PL is simple a Wessel Pointer, cross bred, mutt, whatever you want to call them. If you think I'm wrong, PROVE I'm wrong show one with some letters in front of their name.
Still can't believe the Vikings lost to the Lions
Still can't believe the Vikings lost to the Lions
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Hold on let me get some popcorn,this should be good SOO you really like the lions too
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
So the pointing labs don't perform as well?
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Bwahahaha nice try, you might of thought out the wording better
That hook is soooo BIG i don't know if anyone will bite
That hook is soooo BIG i don't know if anyone will bite
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
http://www.huntwithamunster.com
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
What's wrong with letters behind the name?
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Pointing labs are like unicorns....
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
wasn't there a post on here recently about a contest between pointing labs and other pointing breeds using nstra rules?
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Yes, it was similar to NSTRA rules held in Mi. Pointind dog challenge it was called.
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Sorry, don't know how to set up the link but here's some people I'm sure would love to hear your thoughts, give them a call or shoot them an email:
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Lots of PL breeders in OK??? Weird only know one person who owns one, and he isnt in OK.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I went ahead and bumped the post about the pointing dog challenge to the top. Good job on stirring the pot Nike! I have been pretty bored here at work lately.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Don't know about this pointing Lab. I've cleaned house behind the flushing variety though. Good luck with this. I dunno that bringin down another mans/womans breed accomplishes much however. Guys that like pointing Labs are already sold. I might be too if I ever get a chance to witness one or maybe not. To me it seems like the niche has already been filled
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I clicked on a bunch of those kennels and quite frankly most LabraDoodles have better bloodlines. If you know of anyone that puts out a quality dog let me know.stlgsp wrote:Sorry, don't know how to set up the link but here's some people I'm sure would love to hear your thoughts, give them a call or shoot them an email:
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
nikegundog wrote:I clicked on a bunch of those kennels and quite frankly most LabraDoodles have better bloodlines. If you know of anyone that puts out a quality dog let me know.stlgsp wrote:Sorry, don't know how to set up the link but here's some people I'm sure would love to hear your thoughts, give them a call or shoot them an email:
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
What is your problem?
There was a fair contest between PLs and other pointing breeds and the PLs won.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I'm not arguing that they can compete with pointers, my point was they aren't bred good enough to be considered a Lab.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Im not sure I understand..."not bred good enough". What does that mean? Could you elaborate?nikegundog wrote:I'm not arguing that they can compete with pointers, my point was they aren't bred good enough to be considered a Lab.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
nikegundog wrote:I'm not arguing that they can compete with pointers, my point was they aren't bred good enough to be considered a Lab.
IF your serious ??? thats nonsense. sorry JMHO.
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I dont know what you mean by bred good enough Please explain
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
As far as pointing goes, I can get a German Shepherd or an Aussie to point with some training. Just because a dog points, doesn't mean it is a POINTING DOG.
So if you mix a Poodle and a Pointing Lab. Is that a Pointing Labradoodle which is hypoallergenic?
I would take a GSP, Brittany, Pointer, or Setter anyday. I will keep letting my lab retrieve ducks, and I don't have to brake him from pointing those.
So if you mix a Poodle and a Pointing Lab. Is that a Pointing Labradoodle which is hypoallergenic?
I would take a GSP, Brittany, Pointer, or Setter anyday. I will keep letting my lab retrieve ducks, and I don't have to brake him from pointing those.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
The only lab cross that ive seen that has suckered a lot of people in is going to be a silver lab. And lots of people mistake british labs as mixed or poorly bred. most often fox red british labs.
I have never owned a labrador from pointing lab lines until I do I will not pass any judgement as far as them having or not having strong pointing instincts. I have had a british lab crank a nice point once, I will also mention I missed the pheasant that flushed while i was looking at him thinking "what the heck is this dog doing". I still have him and he hasnt done it since.
PS; if any of the pointing lab crowd would like to give me a pointing lineage labrador I would be willing to be an unbiased "tester" and give an honest feedback of my experiences!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have never owned a labrador from pointing lab lines until I do I will not pass any judgement as far as them having or not having strong pointing instincts. I have had a british lab crank a nice point once, I will also mention I missed the pheasant that flushed while i was looking at him thinking "what the heck is this dog doing". I still have him and he hasnt done it since.
PS; if any of the pointing lab crowd would like to give me a pointing lineage labrador I would be willing to be an unbiased "tester" and give an honest feedback of my experiences!!!!!!!!!!!!
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Always thought it was a myth, until one of the guys in my hunt club ended up with two. They will retrieve anything and will point and hold well. I get the whole bloodline thing. It is great to look at a 5 gen pedigree and love that your dog comes from great bloodlines. All those champions. Awesome feeling. been behind great dogs that had s%$t for blood line and out performed what some people would call promising dogs with some of the best bloodlines. If the dog can do everything you expect and more does it really matter?
By the way those great bloodlines, started with a dog that no one knew anything about. I have a pup that comes from famous names four and five gens back. such as: Elhew Crazy Horse, Fiddlin' Rocky Boy, Additions Go Boy, Bayou Teche Additions, but how much of that is really in the make up of my dog? Does it really mean my dog will be something special in the trials? In the past two gens there is alot of Poker Straight. Some would say Adrian Jackson has a great Kennel Has plenty of champs to back it up. Is it because of what he has done with his breeding program or just that he had dogs at 4 gens that were good?
Find a breeder that has produced great dogs in the past two gens. Talk to people that actually have his dogs, get video as proof. if the dog performs and does everything you want, does 5 gens even matter? Everyone has seen two great dogs that are champions, come from great bloodlines with champions throughout, and still have a few pups that are good meat dogs but nothing more. JMO.
Joe
By the way those great bloodlines, started with a dog that no one knew anything about. I have a pup that comes from famous names four and five gens back. such as: Elhew Crazy Horse, Fiddlin' Rocky Boy, Additions Go Boy, Bayou Teche Additions, but how much of that is really in the make up of my dog? Does it really mean my dog will be something special in the trials? In the past two gens there is alot of Poker Straight. Some would say Adrian Jackson has a great Kennel Has plenty of champs to back it up. Is it because of what he has done with his breeding program or just that he had dogs at 4 gens that were good?
Find a breeder that has produced great dogs in the past two gens. Talk to people that actually have his dogs, get video as proof. if the dog performs and does everything you want, does 5 gens even matter? Everyone has seen two great dogs that are champions, come from great bloodlines with champions throughout, and still have a few pups that are good meat dogs but nothing more. JMO.
Joe
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Honestly the whole pointing lab thing is kind of a Joke to me it seems as though the lab community is all ways trying to find something to make them more rare and desirable than other quality well bred dogs, I have seen at least 4 "silver" lab puppys since I've been at my new Job most of then looked just like weims the one Owner told me that 2 yellow labs make a silver lab hahahahaha bull crap !
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Forget bloodlines. This is what I'm after. Here is my pup at 7 months and I didn't teach him this. If this isn't a pointing dog...then I don't want a pointing dog, or anything else you've got!
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
whats he pointing ? a tennis ball or a Frisbee ?
True "pointing" dogs have been selectively breed pretty much since the invention of gun powder and wing shooting and probably before to point and hold game for its master, labs were bred to mark and retrieve fallen birds, can you train any old mutt to stop on the scent of a bird and hold it yes is it as instinctive and natural and beautiful as a well bred pointing dog heck no ! My cousin owns a Pointing lab does she point hold a retrieve birds for him yes but she was taught to do it not bred to do it he had to have her trained to do it and she was out "pointing" stock. load of crap if you ask me.
True "pointing" dogs have been selectively breed pretty much since the invention of gun powder and wing shooting and probably before to point and hold game for its master, labs were bred to mark and retrieve fallen birds, can you train any old mutt to stop on the scent of a bird and hold it yes is it as instinctive and natural and beautiful as a well bred pointing dog heck no ! My cousin owns a Pointing lab does she point hold a retrieve birds for him yes but she was taught to do it not bred to do it he had to have her trained to do it and she was out "pointing" stock. load of crap if you ask me.
Last edited by gittrdonebritts on Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
May I ask what difference does it make? Yhe dog is pointing just like the pictures we see of a lot of breeds and don't think I ever heard that asked except for the ones with the head crank.gittrdonebritts wrote:whats he pointing ? a tennis ball or a Frisbee ?
Ezzy
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
yellow and yellow make silver? I really have to go back and look at my colors. I am way behind!!!
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
A pigeon on a string...but thanks for your input. It was very helpful. You can actually see the string in the bottom left corner...gittrdonebritts wrote:whats he pointing ? a tennis ball or a Frisbee ?
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Agreedezzy333 wrote:May I ask what difference does it make? Yhe dog is pointing just like the pictures we see of a lot of breeds and don't think I ever heard that asked except for the ones with the head crank.gittrdonebritts wrote:whats he pointing ? a tennis ball or a Frisbee ?
Ezzy
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Great pic.PointingQuail wrote:Forget bloodlines. This is what I'm after. Here is my pup at 7 months and I didn't teach him this. If this isn't a pointing dog...then I don't want a pointing dog, or anything else you've got!
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
With all due respect, if I was evaluating that against a pointing dog standard, it wouldn't pass. If your goal is meat hunting and the only qualifier as a pointing dog is a bird find which involves standing there, much like that challenge apparently was judged, then any dog that stops could be considered a pointing dog. A true pointing dog is judged on more than just finding a bird and standing. To each his own. If you love em, more power to you, but lets not get carried away saying these live up to a pointing dog standard that a pointing dog would be judged against.PointingQuail wrote:Forget bloodlines. This is what I'm after. Here is my pup at 7 months and I didn't teach him this. If this isn't a pointing dog...then I don't want a pointing dog, or anything else you've got!
Last edited by PkerStr8Tail on Thu Sep 29, 2011 9:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
ezzy333 wrote:May I ask what difference does it make? Yhe dog is pointing just like the pictures we see of a lot of breeds and don't think I ever heard that asked except for the ones with the head crank.gittrdonebritts wrote:whats he pointing ? a tennis ball or a Frisbee ?
Ezzy
First off Ezzy it was a retrieving joke cause its a Labrador Retriever and dogs like to retrieve things like tennis balls and frisbee's unless the changed the Classification in AKC and they are Now Pointing Labrador Retrievers ?
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Growing up, never saw any pointing labs, but saw several hunters that would use pointers to point and labs to fetch the shot birds. It was a great mix. So, wouldn't hurt to have a dog that could do both. No matter what, won't give up my pointer. Just found lab guys to hunt with. Once you go that route, you have the best of both worlds, and alot less food and vet bills.
Joe
Joe
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I'm just saying about 95% of them you can trace back to 1 kennel in SD, and you can't tell me that guy didn't have a pointer in the woodshed.jcbuttry8 wrote:Always thought it was a myth, until one of the guys in my hunt club ended up with two. They will retrieve anything and will point and hold well. I get the whole bloodline thing. It is great to look at a 5 gen pedigree and love that your dog comes from great bloodlines. All those champions. Awesome feeling. been behind great dogs that had s%$t for blood line and out performed what some people would call promising dogs with some of the best bloodlines. If the dog can do everything you expect and more does it really matter?
By the way those great bloodlines, started with a dog that no one knew anything about. I have a pup that comes from famous names four and five gens back. such as: Elhew Crazy Horse, Fiddlin' Rocky Boy, Additions Go Boy, Bayou Teche Additions, but how much of that is really in the make up of my dog? Does it really mean my dog will be something special in the trials? In the past two gens there is alot of Poker Straight. Some would say Adrian Jackson has a great Kennel Has plenty of champs to back it up. Is it because of what he has done with his breeding program or just that he had dogs at 4 gens that were good?
Find a breeder that has produced great dogs in the past two gens. Talk to people that actually have his dogs, get video as proof. if the dog performs and does everything you want, does 5 gens even matter? Everyone has seen two great dogs that are champions, come from great bloodlines with champions throughout, and still have a few pups that are good meat dogs but nothing more. JMO.
Joe
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
They must have bred all of the pointer out of him. Because after that picture was taken we flushed and shot that bird and he did this...gittrdonebritts wrote:it was probably a solid black or liver GSP or both
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
So now pointers dont retreive as well as PL either?PointingQuail wrote:They must have bred all of the pointer out of him. Because after that picture was taken we flushed and shot that bird and he did this...gittrdonebritts wrote:it was probably a solid black or liver GSP or both
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
The pot is being stirred and ya'll are in the soup
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
I have a pointing lab also, see he even has the same crooked tail...
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
birddog1968 wrote:The pot is being stirred and ya'll are in the soup
Yes we are, but gundog soup is good soup.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Haha...My dogs tail isn't crooked. He's just so good he was pointing two birds at once. He was just telling me:ACooper wrote:I have a pointing lab also, see he even has the same crooked tail...
"Hey boss, I got one locked down here at 12:00 oclock and theres another you should keep your eye on at my 3:00 oclock....
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
If I catch a dog sitting in the field while there are birds to be found,....... well lets just say he gets to "re-home".
The lab is setting there wondering "why the pointer is hunting so hard, when mom and dad just tie a string to my birds".
I may breed my Brittanys or my Pointer to some labs in the next few weeks. I want to see if I can get a pointing lab. Probably have to FF if there is too much Pointer in there.
The lab is setting there wondering "why the pointer is hunting so hard, when mom and dad just tie a string to my birds".
I may breed my Brittanys or my Pointer to some labs in the next few weeks. I want to see if I can get a pointing lab. Probably have to FF if there is too much Pointer in there.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
ACooper wrote:I have a pointing lab also, see he even has the same crooked tail...
The tail may be a little crooked but I don't think you will find many labs that look that good on point.
Charlie
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Joe, your last paragraph hit the nail on the head, 5 gens doesn't matter, but I defy anyone to find a nicely titled PL that has 2 generations of the same. I asked the question yesterday, and I will do the same thing today, out of the hundreds of pointing labs kennels out there find one that puts out a PL that can also function as a retriever.jcbuttry8 wrote:Always thought it was a myth, until one of the guys in my hunt club ended up with two. They will retrieve anything and will point and hold well. I get the whole bloodline thing. It is great to look at a 5 gen pedigree and love that your dog comes from great bloodlines. All those champions. Awesome feeling. been behind great dogs that had s%$t for blood line and out performed what some people would call promising dogs with some of the best bloodlines. If the dog can do everything you expect and more does it really matter?
By the way those great bloodlines, started with a dog that no one knew anything about. I have a pup that comes from famous names four and five gens back. such as: Elhew Crazy Horse, Fiddlin' Rocky Boy, Additions Go Boy, Bayou Teche Additions, but how much of that is really in the make up of my dog? Does it really mean my dog will be something special in the trials? In the past two gens there is alot of Poker Straight. Some would say Adrian Jackson has a great Kennel Has plenty of champs to back it up. Is it because of what he has done with his breeding program or just that he had dogs at 4 gens that were good?
Find a breeder that has produced great dogs in the past two gens. Talk to people that actually have his dogs, get video as proof. if the dog performs and does everything you want, does 5 gens even matter? Everyone has seen two great dogs that are champions, come from great bloodlines with champions throughout, and still have a few pups that are good meat dogs but nothing more. JMO.
Joe
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Take a look at the standards that the APLA uses when testing Labs who point.
Specifically- note how long the dog is required to *point* in order to receive an acceptable score
in the higher level PL tests.
Don't get me wrong- if you have a Lab who points and you're happy with them- all the power to you......
go take your dog afield & most importantly GO HAVE FUN !!
I just think all this marketing whiz-bang regarding PLs is somewhat comical.
15+ years ago, I spoke to the self-proclaimed "only breeder of PLs in America" over the phone- his initials
were "SW". After about 5 minutes, I realized that he was simply a marketing guy- supplying those with lots of
money to burn, with the next new percieved "mousetrap".
Like I said- GO TO THE TESTING STANDARD for the APLA- specific for their higher level tests. Look how long
the dog is required to *point*, in order to receive a passing score. That will be the beginning, middle & END
of this discussion for most folks who are used to shooting behind/handling broke pointing dogs.
I'll save you all the trouble- here's the "TEST RULES" for the MASTER & GRAND MASTER levels
scroll down to the topic of POINT:
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
Rob
Specifically- note how long the dog is required to *point* in order to receive an acceptable score
in the higher level PL tests.
Don't get me wrong- if you have a Lab who points and you're happy with them- all the power to you......
go take your dog afield & most importantly GO HAVE FUN !!
I just think all this marketing whiz-bang regarding PLs is somewhat comical.
15+ years ago, I spoke to the self-proclaimed "only breeder of PLs in America" over the phone- his initials
were "SW". After about 5 minutes, I realized that he was simply a marketing guy- supplying those with lots of
money to burn, with the next new percieved "mousetrap".
Like I said- GO TO THE TESTING STANDARD for the APLA- specific for their higher level tests. Look how long
the dog is required to *point*, in order to receive a passing score. That will be the beginning, middle & END
of this discussion for most folks who are used to shooting behind/handling broke pointing dogs.
I'll save you all the trouble- here's the "TEST RULES" for the MASTER & GRAND MASTER levels
scroll down to the topic of POINT:
http://www.americanpointinglab.com/site ... fault.aspx
Rob
May all your dog's points be productive & your arrows avoid all timber
Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
This is the first time i have ever heard that this particular breed exists. im shocked.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
Its been crazy over the last 10 years, pointing labs kennels are everywhere, $1000 a pup for dogs that don't have a title in 3 generations.stevoman wrote:This is the first time i have ever heard that this particular breed exists. im shocked.
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Re: A pointing lab is just a lab/cross
birddogger wrote:ACooper wrote:I have a pointing lab also, see he even has the same crooked tail...
The tail may be a little crooked but I don't think you will find many labs that look that good on point.
Charlie
Thanks Charlie